Transcript for
Supporting children with early social and communication differences

Narrator (00:02): 

Welcome to the Emerging Minds Families podcast. 

Jacquie Lee (Host) (00:06): 

Hi, I’m Jacquie Lee, and I’m excited to join you as a guest presenter today on the Emerging Minds Families podcast. I’d like to begin by paying my respects to the traditional custodians of the land on which this podcast is being recorded: the Kaurna people of the Adelaide Plains and the Whadjuk Noongar people of Perth. I also pay respect to all Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples, their ancestors and elders past, present, and emerging from the different First Nations across Australia and recognise the tens of thousands of years of caregiving wisdom they hold. 

(00:43): 

Today, I’m talking with Professor Andrew Whitehouse about the Inklings Program led by The Kids Research Institute Australia. The Inklings Program is for babies aged six to 18 months whose communications skills are developing differently to what might be expected. Their hope is to bring this program to as many families as possible across Australia. Welcome, Andrew. Thanks for joining us. 

Andrew Whitehouse (Guest) (01:07): 

Thank you so much for having me. 

Jacquie Lee (Host) (01:09): 

To start, could you please introduce yourself to our listeners and tell us a bit more about your work? 

Andrew Whitehouse (Guest) (01:17): 

My name’s Andrew Whitehouse. I’m from Perth, I’m Perth born and bred, and I grew up in the world thinking about ways in which I could enable others to have the gifts that I’ve been given in life in terms of where I’ve been born, the family in which I’ve been born to, and the ability to affect change in the world, and so I chose a path towards clinical life. I originally trained as a speech pathologist, but I have to say I was utterly useless at that, and so I suffered a crippling lack of talent and needed to retrain. I retrained as a scientist pretty quickly and fell into the area of kids developing differently really early in my clinical life, and I got utterly addicted to that connection between parents and kids and it’s an addiction I never wanted to shake. And so I’ve sought a career in science to find out new ways in which we can help parents and kids connect with each other and to help those babies and kids be whoever they want to be in the world. 

Jacquie Lee (Host) (02:14): 

Well, it’s an addiction that we’re all benefiting from. You mentioned there that connection between babies and parents, which I understand is the focus of the Inklings Program. Can you tell us a bit more about that program, why you developed it and what the aims are? 

Andrew Whitehouse (Guest) (02:33): 

Absolutely. In the area of kids developing differently, we talk about a clinical pathway, which is essentially how kids progress through health and medical systems and when they’re developing a bit differently. Now, when I was practising clinically and certainly when I see in my scientific life, typically we identified babies developing differently really early on, often in that second six months of the first year of life. But we don’t typically start to actually provide clinical support until about age three, four or five years of age because that’s the first point that we can go very clearly that this is a diagnosable difference, often autism is the diagnosis and that diagnosis is the catalyst, so the start of clinical support. But of course, all of those amazing brain building years happen in the first couple of years of life, and if you’ve ever seen the child develop language, you know just how incredible that brain is. 

(03:26): 

But that clinical pathway that I described just wasn’t taking advantage of those amazing brain building years because we’re providing support first at age three, four, or five. What the Inklings Program sought to do was to actually try to heed the call of parents who are saying that actually we know very early on our baby’s developing differently and can we have a support? Can we have a program that empowers us to support our babies at home? And that’s what the Inklings Program is. It’s helping to identify babies developing differently very early on between six and 18 months of age, showing early social communication differences. We can’t diagnose anything of that age. It’s really just a delay or a difference in their development, and then providing support that empowers parents to build a social environment around the baby that helps the baby develop in the way that’s best for them. And through a clinical trial process, we found that that is actually incredibly powerful in building that connection between the parent and the child and ultimately supporting that child’s development. 

Jacquie Lee (Host) (04:23): 

I’ve read that the program is baby-led, can you explain for us what that means and why it’s important? 

Andrew Whitehouse (Guest) (04:31): 

It’s so important where adults are the boss of their kids in life, but in terms of play, kids are the boss. And that’s the way that we have to approach it is that whatever the kid wants to do at that age between six and 18 months in play, that they’re the boss. The way that babies learn about the world is through play. They explore, so they test the boundaries of their own independence. They test their own motor movements, how they’re developing movement, they test their understanding, their problem solving skills, they test their social initiation, their communication. All of that comes through play. That’s how babies learn. Now, so often when a baby’s developing differently, they’re interacting with parents in a slightly different way to what we typically expect, and so there’s a very natural instinct of humans to be more directive, to get in there and tell babies go this way or this way or this way, and that is parent-led play. That is us telling babies how to play. 

(05:24): 

But what the Inklings Program is about is saying that the babies are developing differently, and maybe they’re not going to learn in the way that we as adults think in a neurotypical way might be best to learn. And so if we follow that baby-led play, then maybe we structure an environment around the baby that’s actually best for the way that they learn, that individual baby learns, so it’s essentially taking note of the baby, letting them do what they want, and us building ourselves around their intentions. 

Jacquie Lee (Host) (05:52): 

And what techniques does the program use? What does a session of Inklings look like? 

Andrew Whitehouse (Guest) (05:58): 

Well, the most powerful technique we use, and it’s a little bit icky when I say it out loud for parents is video, video feedback. Now, there is very few more powerful insights into parenting than watching yourself interacting with your baby on video. It’s a very structured program. It’s 10 sessions over about five months, so fortnightly sessions, and each session unfolds in a really characteristic and typical way. But generally speaking, what we seek to do is to film parents, and then play that back in a really structured way and provide very key pieces of feedback at certain times. 

(06:32): 

Generally speaking, what we seek to do is to help parents with three messages. Number one is how important they are to their baby’s development. Often when your baby’s developing differently, we have families coming to us where the parents are feeling, “I’m not too sure if my baby’s too fond of me,” because the baby’s interacting with them in a slightly different way to what they typically expect. But through video feedback, we can show very clearly just how important that parent is to the baby. Just a simple example is the baby might be crawling away, and then they might look back at the parent and you just pause it there and you just say to the parent, “Do you see? You are the most important person in your baby’s life.” You are the sun around which your baby revolves. That’s the first thing, that you are so critical to their development. 

(07:16): 

Secondly, that your baby is communicating with you just in ways that you didn’t expect through their body language, through their facial expressions, through their vocalising. All of that is communication, trying to grab your attention. 

(07:28): 

And the third thing is how that parent can structure the environment around the baby to help the baby develop in a way that’s best for them, to help the baby learn in the way that’s best for them, not in the way that’s best for us. It provides those techniques and that unfolds over the course of 10 sessions. 

Jacquie Lee (Host) (07:45): 

It sounds lovely, very affirming for parents who might not necessarily know what to look out for because as you mentioned, they have these neurotypical ideas of how babies behave and respond in these relationships. Before we go any further, could you explain for our listeners what you mean when you talk about social interaction and communication development? 

Andrew Whitehouse (Guest) (08:09): 

Absolutely. When I think about social interaction and communication, I always go back to these amazing studies that have happened over the last 20, 30 years, all took place within the maternity ward that when babies are born, there were these experiments that showed that babies look at the face more than they look at arms. They look at the eyes more than they look at ears. Babies are born knowing that social interaction and communication are the most important things that we will ever do. And I try to remember that when I’m at work at eight or nine o’clock, it’s time to go home and do the most important thing. Social interaction communication is hardwired in all of us. It’s just that for some babies it happens in a different way. So really from the earliest moments, babies interact, they use their eye contact, they use their body language, they use vocalising, they use gaze. All of these things is communication. 

(09:02): 

And actually, you can have whole non-verbal eight to 10 turn back and forward communication just through the use of body language and eyes. And as I mentioned that some babies typically go through a path all the way through to learning words and then sentences, but not all babies. And sometimes they’re interacting in a different way and maybe that non-verbal communication will last longer than we expect typically. What we help parents to understand is that that is still communication that your baby is desperate to communicate with you. And what we help parents do is to read their baby’s mind, to understand what their baby’s intention is so they can then be a good communication partner back. 

Jacquie Lee (Host) (09:40): 

You mentioned there things like eye contact, vocalisation, body language. What might a parent notice that suggests their child may have some differences in these areas? 

Andrew Whitehouse (Guest) (09:52): 

Not one thing. That’s a really important thing to say that development happens at all different paces for different babies. Milestones are super, super important, but they can also be really misleading because they say that by 12 months old, babies should be standing or walking. It’s an important marker to have, but it can also raise the anxiety around, oh, because of course there’s variation around that. What we tend to look at is a cluster of behaviours. 

(10:17): 

Let’s take a 12-month-old baby, and 12-month-old baby, typically what we’d be expecting is that baby is able to respond to their name, just not necessarily through vocalising, but through a switch of attention when the baby hears their name. We’d be expecting babies to be able to imitate certain things. An imitation is so important for how we learn, so wait, but by clapping hands, those kinds of things, we expect a certain degree of eye contact because eye contact again is another way that babies learn. That’s not to say that it’s the only way, but it is an important way in which babies learn other things such as showing parents things because it interests them that, “Oh, look at this toy, Mum. Look at this toy, Dad, take a look at this.” 

(10:57): 

All of these in and of themselves, one offs. If we’re not seeing that, it’s nothing for us to raise our kind of attention. But if we start to see 3, 4, 5 of these different behaviours within the same baby, not being a parent, then we start to go, “Let’s provide this baby a little bit more of attention than otherwise.” So again, it’s not one marker, it’s a cluster of markers that help us identify the general developmental track of a baby. 

Jacquie Lee (Host) (11:22): 

You mentioned before neurotypical ideas around development. I’m wondering, how does the Inklings Program align with the social model of disability and a neuroaffirming approach to practice? 

Andrew Whitehouse (Guest) (11:36): 

Yeah, I think it’s a great question because it’s something that we had in mind all the way along the development process. So this is what we would call part of the new generation of supports where the co-designing and the collaboration with the disability community has been critical to how it’s emerged. And so the Inklings Program aligns perfectly with a social model of disability. The social model of disability essentially says, rather than the medical model of disability, so the medical model of disability says that the impairment is with the individual and the individual needs to fit with society. 

(12:09): 

What the social model is flip that on its head and say that actually, so much of the disability is being generated by a world that’s not accommodated to individual needs, and that’s essentially what the Inklings Program is. It’s saying that the baby is beautiful however they come into the world, and what we need to do is structure an environment around the baby that is unique to them. Let’s change the environment around the baby that’s unique to them to help them learn in a way that’s best for them. So it’s exactly responding to that social model where we’re changing the environment to meet the needs of the baby. 

Jacquie Lee (Host) (12:41): 

And that aligns with the neuroaffirming lens as well, that any difference isn’t a bad thing, or there are all different kinds of brains out there. 

Andrew Whitehouse (Guest) (12:51): 

Yeah, that’s exactly right, it’s spot on. And neuroaffirming approaches, it’s about they’re all different types of brains, and that’s to be nurtured and cherished and not to be changed. And again, that’s totally consistent with the Inklings Program where it’s about actually let’s change the environment so the baby learns in the way that’s best to them. It’s not about changing behaviour, it’s not about changing the neurotype, it’s about adapting an environment to meet the neurotype. It so happens that actually when you change the environment to meet the neurotype, a lot of the internal disability that we might see around disability and communication, for example, actually is reduced because of course, the baby’s learning in the way that’s best for them. It’s just a logical extension of that. But at the core of the program, it’s not about changing the baby, it’s about changing the environment so they can learn those elements that are going to be critical to their long-term happiness and wellbeing. 

Jacquie Lee (Host) (13:42): 

I had seen some concerns raised online that the program encourages masking in babies and aims to reduce autism diagnoses, but it sounds like that’s not the case. 

Andrew Whitehouse (Guest) (13:55): 

Oh gosh, no. Not at all. And in fact, the program has been really very much co-developed along with our autistic colleagues all the way there. A couple of things to say there is that firstly, babies can’t mask. Babies are young and intentional beings and simply don’t have that ability to mask. But again, simply at the core of the program is not about changing behaviour. The changing the behaviour is a response to the changing the environment to meet the needs. We’ve done some consultation work with hundreds of autistic colleagues across the world and collaborators across the world and at the core of the desires of our autistic colleagues has been about developing interventions and supports that are actually about that, about nurturing the baby as to how they are and changing that environment around the baby. And that’s totally at the core of the Inklings Program and really not many of the new generation of therapies that are doing that. So it’s really meeting all of those calls for neuroaffirming therapy, which is just fantastic. 

Jacquie Lee (Host) (14:54): 

What are some of the key findings that have emerged from the Inklings trials in Western Australia and now South Australia? 

Andrew Whitehouse (Guest) (15:02): 

What’s led up to the implementation pilots in WA and South Australia is a couple of clinical trials. One that was taken in the UK and one that happened in Australia. And again, there were replicated findings there, which is the gold standard. Gold standard in science is doing the clinical trials and then doing replicated trials so you can understand whether those findings can be repeated across time, and that’s what happened in this case. 

(15:27): 

What we found is that it supports that parent-child connection, that there is a stronger parent-child connection, which comes out during those beautiful one-on-one play times, but also supporting longer term reductions in social and communication disabilities. The baby is able to interact with the broader world with greater capability than they were if they didn’t receive the program, and that was replicated in a couple of clinical trials. It does reduce those longer term disabilities that provide also short-term disability because it was measured up to two years post the end of the program that do provide barriers for longer term development. Those trials provide the evidence that with a catalyst for the big implementation pilots that are happening in WA and SA at the moment, and those data are now being collected and it’ll be really important for us to understand that what we saw in the clinical trials when it goes out into the big wide world, do we also see those really impressive and exciting results? So that still remains to be seen. 

Jacquie Lee (Host) (16:23): 

Are there any plans to do a longer term follow up study beyond that two years post the program? Just thinking about when kids get into school, for example, and how complicated and challenging those environments can be. 

Andrew Whitehouse (Guest) (16:41): 

The longer term studies are the absolute utopia. They take enormous amount of resources over a long, long time, so the initial studies in the UK and Australia we, we were funded and were resourced to follow kids to up to two years after the end of the program. That in itself is pretty remarkable in the field, often the field really only studies people immediately after the end of the program so we were really excited to see in both trials, not just to be resourced to actually do that, but also to replicated results up to two years after the end. Those trials were not designed for longer term follow up, but certainly the ultimate is to do those longer term follow up. What platform, what foundation does the Inklings Program provide for those longer term outcomes in terms of school and beyond? So certainly that’s on our radar. 

(17:26): 

I just want to make the point here is that in terms of childhood, you change the start of the story, you change the story. And so often in the area of difference in early childhood development, we’re really only coming in at chapter three or four, and the ability to change that story at that point is limited. Now, when I’m talking about story, what I’m talking about is the barriers in which that child is going to face in life. What we’ve found through the Inklings Program is by providing it earlier, and at the time at which the parents and the child needs the most, you can actually set the child on a path, the developmental trajectory to reduce longer term barriers. You can’t do that to the same extent if we only come in at chapter three or four, the ultimate is we want that child to have the same opportunities as every other child, to be whomever they want to be. And by providing that support early in life, that’s the goal. 

Jacquie Lee (Host) (18:16): 

We’ve talked a lot throughout this conversation about developmental differences, and that idea of difference can be quite scary for parents, right? Especially when it comes to their child’s development. What message do you have for parents whose child might be showing early differences around communication and social interaction? 

Andrew Whitehouse (Guest) (18:37): 

I mean, probably the most important thing is that as parents, you know more than you think you do, I would always say trust your gut on these types of things because there is nobody who knows your baby at this point in time more than you, so you know far more than you think you do. The other thing that I would say, and it really goes back to that first moment in my clinical life that I encountered. I first encountered the area of child development and developmental difference in when I was about 18 and clinically I was doing my clinical training and my mum, we had a family friend diagnosed with autism, child diagnosed with autism. 

(19:10): 

My mum said, “You’re a good lad. Go over and provide some support for the family.” 

(19:13): 

I’m like, “Sure.” 

(19:14): 

So off I tootled, and I was 18 and probably a little bit in a hedonistic phase of life. And so what I encountered just knocked my socks off. There was a beautiful, funny, cheeky boy who was clearly having these most significant difficulties learning language. He had intellectual disability, he’s really struggling with various other elements, and just this incredible beautiful family who had brought him beyond belief but was struggling to find their way forward, struggling to understand how best to support their child. And I remember Mum saying to me in certain words that she never knew she had this amount of love inside of her until she met her child. And I’ve heard that hundreds if not thousands of times across the journey, and that’s the other message that I would give to parents is that love that you have between your child and you, that’s your superpower. That is your superpower that will help you support that baby in the way that they need. 

Jacquie Lee (Host) (20:07): 

That’s beautiful. And how can practitioners address a parent’s concerns around developmental differences in a way that is neuroaffirming but doesn’t invalidate or blame or shame the parent? 

Andrew Whitehouse (Guest) (20:20): 

Yeah. Well, for starters, listen, what happens when we become practitioners is we see babies developing differently, dozens a week, and it’s during the hurly burly of life, it’s really, it can become challenging to always remember that that 60 minutes or 45 minutes that that family is spending with you is perhaps amongst the most important 45 minutes that parent has spent in their whole parenthood journey. And I know most clinicians are just absolutely brilliant at this, sometimes it’s really hard when we’re racing between various things. 

(20:53): 

Firstly is listen, to understand how important this conversation is to that parent. Validate their concerns and that understand where that parent is at that particular time. We’ve got to meet kids and families where they are, where they are right now, and that might be at a stage where they are ready to embrace the difference in their babies. There might be a time where they’re not, and what can we do with that child and family first in line to help support them on the journey so that that asset, that sort of superpower that I mentioned, that love between a parent and child remains first and foremost, and we can use that and leverage that to support the child going forward. 

Jacquie Lee (Host) (21:30): 

That flows nicely into my next question, which was around how does Inklings help parents to recognise and maybe gently let go of any neurotypical beliefs they might be holding about how their babies should behave? 

Andrew Whitehouse (Guest) (21:45): 

Yeah, it’s really tough because in the context, if we talk about in the context of neurodifference, it is absolutely fine and okay for parents to have expectations of their child. There’s all these amazing scientific studies that study what parents’ expectations of kids are when the baby is still in the mum’s womb, what are our expectations to the child? And having gone through this a few times myself, we absolutely have expectations and that’s absolutely fine, and that’s just human nature. What we all encounter in one way, shape, or form is this a hard meeting with reality and when the baby comes out and sport is the most important thing to you, but at three, four or five, all they want to do is read books. Hello. That’s my experience. It could be on that level, it could be on the level of music, it could be on all sorts of levels, and it can also be on the level of a really deep-seated emotional contact and how that baby is developing. 

(22:41): 

That is really at the core that when it gets down to it, yes, we might want our baby to play sport or to be musical or be academic, but ultimately what we want is the world to value them as much as we value them and that sometimes that can be clouded when we see our baby struggling so much. So I guess the message from me and also through the Inklings Program is to help parents understand early, that difference is what children are. No baby is the same. No matter if they’re developing typically or not, no baby is the same and that all babies need help in one way, shape, or form. This is the area in which your baby needs a little bit of extra support and this will help them going forward. 

(23:20): 

Your job as a parent, and it’s really important for all of us, no matter how your baby’s developing early on, is to meet your baby how they come. And we all struggle with that as parents at different times in our life. With parents of babies developing differently, it just so happens it comes a little bit earlier than others. And so how do we help parents on that journey by first recognising that it’s okay that you had different expectations, and then secondly, helping them support them through that process and to the point where they go, “You know what? Being a little bit different. It’s not just okay with me, it’s bloody brilliant.” 

Jacquie Lee (Host) (23:54): 

How are the insights gained from the Inklings sessions extended to the other important relationships and environments in the infant’s life? We’ve talked about a key focus of the program being about structuring the environment around the child to suit their unique needs. And obviously the program works with parents, but I’m thinking of early childcare settings, for example. 

Andrew Whitehouse (Guest) (24:19): 

Yeah, I’m a huge believer that the worst way to support kids is to remove them from their home and community environments and then drive them half an hour to come and see me within the four walls of a clinic and then remove them from that, and then off they go back into their own lives. There are many, many examples where that is actually a really good option because that child needs specialised support, and that often happens a bit later in childhood, three, four, or five. But in those early phases, what we need to do is support kids and families where they exist, where with the people, places and spaces in which they inhabit and interact every day of their lives. And certainly for many kids and families, not only is that just the home, so it’s about empowering parents within the home, but it’s also in early childhood education and care, which provides a hugely important opportunity for equity in terms of developmental outcomes across different communities in Australia and across the world. 

(25:23): 

How can we ensure that early childhood educators are empowered with the same message through the Inklings Program that amidst the hurly burly, take the time to invest in play. That is exactly how parent and babies will learn, but not just in play that is led by you, but how do you create a space, the time, the attention, the energy to help that baby explore and for you to follow them and for you to be a passenger on that journey and so they can do that play in the way that’s best for them. That’s really hard within an ECEC setting because of the hurly burly of dozens and dozens of kids, but that would be my message. How can we structure an economic environment to allow that within ECEC settings? Then a workforce environment where educators are not just skilled but empowered to give that time, space, attention and energy for that same baby-led inquiry in play, that will be the building block of all development. 

(26:22): 

And it’s tough, right? We can’t have centres operating at losses, but we also at the same time have to get to grips with all the science that we know in our parent how kids develop. Look, the soil in which kids grow is time, space, attention, and energy. That’s the soil in which kids grow. And in 2025, we’ve never been shorter on that in human history. So what can we do to rebuild that in the everyday settings in which kids live? Yep, the home, absolutely. Time, space, attention, energy. Boy, are we short of that in my household, and I’m sure the household of many listeners as well, but also in ECEC settings, how can we create a fertile soil of time, space, attention, and energy that creates an environment of 8, 9, 10 hours a day in which kids can truly develop in the way that we’re evolved to develop. 

Jacquie Lee (Host) (27:10): 

Here at Emerging Minds, we have what we call a framework called PERCS, which is just five key areas of a child’s life that make a big difference to the mental health and wellbeing. And P stands for parent-child relationships, and we talk about how that one-on-one time to connect, where you’re not distracted by your phone, where you’re just sitting with your child and following their lead, how it doesn’t even necessarily need to be a lot of time, even five or 10 minutes of undivided attention can have such a massive difference on their wellbeing, but also your parent-child relationship more broadly. 

Andrew Whitehouse (Guest) (27:51): 

Totally. And you are absolutely spot on. And let’s say upfront, this is hard. This is hard. We have so many demands on our time, and that buzzing thing in our hand has actually given us a dependence on it that none of us asked for, but nevertheless, we all have. So it’s hard, and I feel it as well, and you are exactly right. I said an hour, but five or 10 minutes of uninterrupted time in which we sit there studying our baby, being fascinated by their mind, being captured by their world, allow them to invite us into their world and you take up that invitation. That is the gold dust of parenting, that is the gold dust where your child will feel valued, understood, wanted, needed, loved. That’s where we get the parent-child connection from. 

Jacquie Lee (Host) (28:38): 

I think that’s a really valuable message for parents to hear as well, because you can often feel like you’re never quite doing enough in every aspect of your life, right? 

Andrew Whitehouse (Guest) (28:50): 

None of us are. And look, I’m failing on all fronts. Let me just tell you, I am failing on all fronts. And so the biggest thing that you can do is not give yourself a comparison goal, but give yourself your own individual level goals. Today, I’m going to have 15 minutes today, I’m going to have 20 minutes uninterrupted time where I’m just going to sit there and be a hostage to my baby and their play. And by the end of it, you’ll find that you’ve been invited into a world that truly you won’t have again. And it’s the time that you will never, never regret having. There are things as your baby’s getting to childhood and then older, we do regret how we may have spent our time. I am yet to hear a parent having spoken with hundreds, thousands of parents over my journey who have regretted spending time playing with their child. However hard it is, do it because it won’t be regretted. 

Jacquie Lee (Host) (29:41): 

Absolutely. To close the episode, can you tell us who is eligible for the Inklings Program and how they can register? Do they need a referral at all? 

Andrew Whitehouse (Guest) (29:51): 

Yeah, so babies don’t need a referral. You can self-refer into the program, but certainly health professionals can refer as well. And if families go to www.inklings.org.au, you can see how you can self-refer in, and there’ll be a checklist to help to understand whether your baby might be eligible, if they’re showing early social communication delays and differences. But really, it’s for babies aged six to 18 months who are showing early social communication delays and differences, so if they go to that website, inklings.org.au, you’ll see it all there. 

Jacquie Lee (Host) (30:23): 

Great. We’ll put the link to the website in the show notes as well. Thank you so much for joining us, Andrew. It’s been a pleasure chatting with you, and I look forward to seeing what you do next. 

Andrew Whitehouse (Guest) (30:32): 

No worries. Thanks, Jacquie. 

Jacquie Lee (Host) (30:34): 

Thanks for listening. If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe to our channel, leave us a rating or review or share the episode with a friend, colleague, or family member. Take care, and we look forward to seeing you next time. 

Narrator (30:49): 

Visit our website at www.emergingminds.com.au/families for a wide range of free information and resources to help support child and family mental health. Emerging Minds leads the National Workforce Centre for Child Mental Health. The Centre is funded by the Australian Government Department of Health under the National Support for Child and Youth Mental Health Program.