Transcript for
Finding the right daycare, kindergarten or preschool for your child

Narrator (00:02): 

Welcome to the Emerging Minds Families Podcast. 

Nadia Rossi (Host) (00:06): 

Hi, I am Nadia Rossi and you’re listening to an Emerging Minds Families Podcast. Aside from the family home, children spend the majority of their time in education. Today we’ll be focusing on early childhood services. They can be known as early learning centres, daycare centres, kindergartens, or childcare. We’ll be speaking with Sally Braddy. She’s the assistant director for the children’s program at Gowrie South Australia about how to find the right early childhood service for your child. Welcome, Sally. It is great to speak with you today. 

Sally Braddy (Guest) (00:38): 

Thank you, Nadia. 

Nadia Rossi (Host) (00:39): 

What should parents know about the standard of early childhood services in Australia? 

Sally Braddy (Guest) (00:43): 

The early childhood services in Australia are governed by what we call the National Quality Standard. So this sets a high national benchmark for early childhood education and care and outside of school hours care in Australia. So childcare centres are rated under seven quality areas and they include educational programs and practice, children’s health and safety, physical environment, staffing arrangements, relationships with children, collaborative partnerships with families and communities and governance and leadership. Centres will get a rating, which will be either significant improvement required, working towards the National Quality Standard, meeting the national quality standard, exceeding the national quality standard, or excellent. So centres are required by law to display their rating as I just described. 

Nadia Rossi (Host) (01:35): 

Sure. Can parents see those ratings or find them anywhere? 

Sally Braddy (Guest) (01:39): 

So they should be displayed somewhere visual in the centre, and if not, you could request that rating. 

Nadia Rossi (Host) (01:46): 

I didn’t know that. That’s interesting to know. If a family is just starting out on their journey to find an early childhood service, what should they know about their process? 

Sally Braddy (Guest) (01:56): 

I guess you can use, as a starting point, information from friends and family, those who’ve experienced it before. But when you get really down into it, I think the best way to figure out what you want from an early childhood service is to actually go and take tours of services. When I tour people through the service where I work, I always suggest to do other tours and do a few because they can be significantly different. For example, there’s a profit-based part of the sector of centres that are owned by individuals or large corporations. There’s not-for-profits and these can be standalone community centres or they can be part of larger corporations as well. So there’s differences also in educational philosophies or pedagogical approaches. That’s their approach to teaching and learnings. For example, we’ve got Reggio Emilia, Montessori, some have relationship-based focus. There’s lots of different things that you can come into contact with that you may not know about. So taking the time, figuring out what your priorities are when selecting a childcare centre is really important. 

Nadia Rossi (Host) (03:06): 

When you say Montessori and Reggio Emilia, who’s the best person to explain that to you? Is it the person that’s taking you on the tour? Just to know that how do parents find out information on what Montessori is or what they are. 

Sally Braddy (Guest) (03:19): 

So each centre will have a different approach. So I guess for that particular centre, asking the person who is touring you around, questions about that philosophy and what that means in, I guess, layman’s terms and what that would look like for you child would be the best way to get that information. But they’re all slightly different, so they’re going to be the experts in what’s happening in their centre. 

Nadia Rossi (Host) (03:43): 

And I guess that’s why you say to go and see a lot of different centres because one philosophy may not work for you, but another may work for you as a family. 

Sally Braddy (Guest) (03:52): 

Yeah. And we all have different hopes and aspirations for our children. We have ideas about what we want their education to look like. Sometimes we want that to be the same as what we experienced. Sometimes we want that to be completely different to what we’ve experienced ourselves. But to establish that shared family idea is an important part of making this selection. 

Nadia Rossi (Host) (04:15): 

Sally, what do you think are some of the high quality indicators when you are on a tour of an early childhood service? As a parent, what do you think they should look out for that would signify to them that this is of a high quality or a high standard? 

Sally Braddy (Guest) (04:28): 

I suggest that when you’re on a tour, what does the centre sound like? Are there noises of children happily playing? Are there respectful conversations going on? There are going to be some distressed children. Are they being comforted? Are they being seen to or not just left alone to deal with that discomfort? And things like thoughtful information sharing with families. You’d also like to consider what the centre looks like. Are children engaged? Are they playing happily? Are they involved in activities? Those type of thing. Are teachers and educators engaging alongside these children or are they off just doing busy work and the children are left to their own devices? 

(05:11): 

I guess what you’re looking for is that genuine interest from educators. Is children’s learning respectfully displayed? So is there evidence of learning and previous activities displayed on the walls? Are there folders of children’s learning? Are inviting environment set up? So if you walk into a childcare centre, throw yourself back into childhood. Are they spaces that you would like to play in? Are there interesting things, resources? Is there ample choice for children and enough resources for children to share? Are there large spacious areas or are children crammed into tiny little rooms? You want space for your child to move so they can be with groups of children or they can be alone at different times. Outside, are there large natural play spaces where children can explore and play freely and run, be active? And I guess, are the children in the centre engaged in play-based learning it’s something to look for. 

Nadia Rossi (Host) (06:10): 

And when you say play-based learning, what do you mean? Because I’ve had my children go through daycare as well, and play-based learning was a phrase that was used. But for people listening who may not have their children in an early learning service yet, what is play-based learning? What does it mean? 

Sally Braddy (Guest) (06:26): 

So play-based learning will look like children just playing, but they may be engaged in an activity that has been thoughtfully set out by a teacher. For example, there might be water play, they might be experimenting with containers, they might be discussing volume. If I pour that from one container to another, will it fit or is it going to be too much? So there’s concepts that teachers will be playing with children and introducing. 

Nadia Rossi (Host) (06:53): 

Great. When visiting a potential early childhood service, what might indicate to a family that it’s not the right place for them? 

Sally Braddy (Guest) (07:01): 

Well, pretty much the opposite of what I was just talking about, disengaged children. There might be a bit of chaos or arguments going on. Small amounts of disengagement may occur in all programmes, but when there’s large numbers of children just roaming around, nothing to do, there’s not many resources, children looking bored, children upset that are kind of being ignored, things that are red flags. Not enough resources. Sterile environments are a bit of a red flag. Disengaged educators that are prioritising busy work or on iPads or screens and not engaging with the children are red flags. 

Nadia Rossi (Host) (07:47): 

When a family is taking one of these tours and they’re going to many different centres, what questions would you recommend they ask? 

Sally Braddy (Guest) (07:56): 

So you’re looking to ask about the things that you can’t see. So the numbers of children per room, the adult to child ratios, which are how many adults per numbers of children, and they will vary across age groups. I do need to say that these can vary slightly from state to state so you will need to check in with your state authority to figure out what those ratios would be. You could ask about how the centre is managed, whether it’s profit-based, not-for-profit. And you could ask about how those funds are used if there is a profit. Are they rolled over back into the children’s programmes, hiring staff, facilities, resources, those type of things that are actually going to benefit your children? Or are those funds going off into other factors or propping up other centres for them? 

(08:46): 

It’s important to ask about staff turnover and retention strategies that centres have. For example, there will be a small amount of turnover. It’s the nature of the sector at the moment, but asking how long staff have been with you. There might be some small amount of turnover, but there also may be staff that have worked for 20 years. So it’s analysing that as a whole picture how they communicate with families. There are different forms of communication in early childhood these days that can be from face-to-face communication or communication on apps. A lot of centres are using apps as a form of communicating children’s learning, but how often do they use apps and do they have time away from the children to use these apps or are they on screens reporting to parents while they’re meant to be engaging with the children? So there’s some really interesting things to think about how centres communicate. Like I talked about earlier, what is the center’s philosophy and their pedagogy? So the theories that influence the teaching and learning are all good questions to ask. It’s important to ask about the transition and orientation process. 

Nadia Rossi (Host) (09:59): 

With the transition process, I am wondering, do you have some tips or strategies for helping children to transition smoothly into an early childhood service or what process that a family should look out for the childhood service they’re going to would hopefully have in place for their child to transition smoothly or is as smoothly as possible? 

Sally Braddy (Guest) (10:22): 

Yeah, I would recommend at least transition process of a minimum of two visits for approximately an hour each visit just to familiarise the child with the environment, the people. Transition is also very important for families. So parents need to be able to come into these visits as well. It’s important that the family feels comfortable about leaving their child in care. And getting to know the educators and teachers is only going to make them more comfortable. 

Nadia Rossi (Host) (10:51): 

It’s such a huge process for a family to take their child to chunks. 

Sally Braddy (Guest) (10:55): 

Yeah, it’s massive. 

Nadia Rossi (Host) (10:57): 

It’s huge. 

Sally Braddy (Guest) (10:57): 

Yeah. 

Nadia Rossi (Host) (10:57): 

And I think some children take to it really naturally and some children don’t. If a family is experiencing a difficult transition with their child into an early childhood service, what advice would you give them? 

Sally Braddy (Guest) (11:10): 

If the transition were difficult, I would be requesting more visits prior to actually commencing care and trying to gather some resources from the centre that you can take home. For example, maybe getting photos of the educators that will be with your child so you can talk to your child at home. So those faces become familiar, the names become familiar to the child. You could also, if you are stuck and having to start care, start with shorter days and build up the time as they grow in confidence and develop those relationships and attachments to the educators. Do some visits outside of those book days. So continue to do visits when your child’s not booked in will also help them to settle more and become familiar with the environment. 

(11:59): 

There’s often a funny debate over if children should do more than one day in childcare because children do tend to settle with more than one day in care, but often there’s only one day available or the family only needs one day. So developing some strategies around that and having extra visits might help the child to settle a bit better. 

Nadia Rossi (Host) (12:19): 

I’m wondering about how parents can stay involved. So how can a parent stay involved and engaged in their child’s experience once they’ve started at the early childhood service? 

Sally Braddy (Guest) (12:30): 

I would recommend developing good relationships with educators and teachers. So having that information sharing and those conversations at the start and end of each day is very important to gather that information about how your child’s days gone. You can be involved in a multitude of different ways and it’s different from centre to centre. You could have opportunities to come in and share maybe some of your skills. You might want to read a story. You might have skills in cooking. You might have cultural experience that you can bring into the room and spend some time with the children’s sharing those experiences. There may be a management committee that you could be a part of. A lot of community-based centres have a parent committee. And that involvement can range from being a member of fundraising committee to actually taking on executive roles as part of those committees. You could volunteer time in a working bee. There are multiple ways of getting involved in your children’s early childhood service and that also may be just attending events and responding to surveys, giving feedback on policies and procedures when requested. 

(13:46): 

I guess the understanding these days from early childhood services is that we all have different workloads, family expectations. We’re all busy people, so contributions come in different forms these days. 

Nadia Rossi (Host) (13:59): 

And how do you think parents can stay connected to the staff and ensure that effective communication take into account? I guess everyone’s capacities are different these days. So how would you ensure that families stay connected to the early childhood service? 

Sally Braddy (Guest) (14:17): 

I recommend allowing a bit of time at the start and end of each day to have those conversations. I guess every relationship starts with respect. It’s greeting each other in the mornings, in the evenings. Finding out a bit about your child’s educator might be helpful to engage conversations, sharing extra information about your family. Something special you did over the weekend that the child was involved with is always a good way. Responding to requests for meetings or written information is another good way to stay involved. I know it’s difficult. We all have a lot of demands and I know childcare centres are looking at different ways to maintain that communication. So there are the apps now available that work similar to social media, so engaging in those might be what some people are capable of. But there’s lots of different ways these days. 

Nadia Rossi (Host) (15:13): 

There’s such great strategies that you’ve given. And just greeting each other, I think that’s just such a really simple way of keeping in the back of your mind because drop-offs can be busy and we can want to run out the door. And so that’s just something really simple, I think, that people can take away with them. I was wondering, can a family ask about staff qualifications? 

Sally Braddy (Guest) (15:34): 

Yeah, for sure. And it’s an important question to ask because qualifications can be many and varied. It’s also important to ask if qualifications are actually achieved or whether staff are working towards qualifications. So I guess the qualifications in early childhood services include bachelor trained early childhood teachers to diploma trained educators and certificate III trained educators. But there’s also waivers that can be granted to childcare centres if they’re struggling to get staff or there’s a shortage. So there could be a waiver for an early childhood teacher. Someone could be working in that role that hasn’t actually achieved that educational outcome yet. So they could be halfway through a bachelor’s degree and be working as a teacher in an early childhood service. 

Nadia Rossi (Host) (16:25): 

So there can be varying levels of qualifications and training in one early childhood service? 

Sally Braddy (Guest) (16:31): 

Yeah. And they’re structured in a way that each room should be led either by a teacher or a diploma qualified educator and then have lower levels of qualification working underneath them. Different centres structure their staffing differently. I guess what it comes down to is that investment into paying wages and how they structure their staffing around that. 

Nadia Rossi (Host) (16:59): 

And Sally, what steps would you advise a family to take if they are at a early childhood service and they’re not happy with the service, maybe their child’s not happy or they’ve seen a few maybe red flags that they’re concerned about. If a parent has concerns, what’s the way that you would recommend they approach the centre? 

Sally Braddy (Guest) (17:20): 

I have found over my experience that sometimes parents are really reluctant to make a complaint because they feel like that something may be taken out on their child or their child may be left because their parent has complained. I encourage complaints if they’re there. Part of the national quality standard and being assessed for childcare centres is to have a quality improvement plan. So we should be aiming to improve our practises all the time. Meeting the needs of families is a priority in an early childhood service. So making a complaint, you should get a response or something like, “Thanks for your feedback. I will follow that up. We can look at these various methods of improving that for you and getting feedback on how that improvement went.” It should be the process that they go through if you’ve had to complain about something. 

(18:15): 

If you’re not seeing any action and a disregard to your complaint, I would have further concerns and maybe go to a higher level. But I have seen a lot of families just up and leave services because they’re not happy with the care they’re receiving and their complaints aren’t being heard, so they just tend to move on. 

Nadia Rossi (Host) (18:34): 

It is such a personal thing as well, but there’s some really great, I think, steps for parents to take. Sally, how important do you think environment is to an early childhood service? So their play environment, what shows a parent or a child that it’s safe and that it’s a stimulating environment for the child? 

Sally Braddy (Guest) (18:56): 

So the environment is very important. For example, the Reggio Emilia philosophy refers to the environment as the third educator. So meaning that a well-planned, thoughtful environment is going to engage children in learning, it’s going to stimulate educational outcomes. So the environment is really, really important. Like I said, it should have ample resources. It should be engaging to children. It should prompt them to ask questions to inquire further. And you were talking about space and how things are set up and safety. So we are all governed by national law and that sets out the regulations on safety requirements. And for those things that push the limits of safety, we’ve got benefit risk assessments and they should be available to families to view. Some centres will consult with families if they’re going to, I guess, instal something that they think slightly risky. 

(20:06): 

For example, my centre at the moment is developing benefit risk assessment and having consultations with families about having a fire pit within the service. So we’ve had really positive feedback on that from families and they’re really keen to get that involved, but it is something that adds an element of risk, but we are managing that risk. 

Nadia Rossi (Host) (20:27): 

That’s great. I remember my daughter’s childcare centre had, they did damper making and so they had the little fire pit there. And it’s so great for them to experience that and also learn the safety around it, but also see the different, I don’t even know, the textures of making the damper and the coal and everything like that. She just absolutely loved it. Yeah, I think environment can play a huge role. And I love that you said that it’s the third educator. I think that’s a really great thing to keep in mind when parents are viewing centres. 

(20:58): 

Sally, if our audience remembers nothing else from this podcast, what would you want to leave them on their journey to finding an early childhood service? 

Sally Braddy (Guest) (21:05): 

I guess where I started, that it’s important to do your research. And I think if you do your research and you figure out what you want for your child, that you’re less likely to encounter those longer term issues and pull your child out in the future and have that change for them. 

Nadia Rossi (Host) (21:23): 

Thank you. Thanks for joining us today, Sally. 

Narrator (21:27): 

Visit our website at www.emergingminds.com.au/families for a wide range of free information and resources to help support child and family mental health. Emerging Minds leads the National Workforce Centre for Child Mental Health. The centre is funded by the Australian Government Department of Health under the National Support for Child and Youth Mental Health Program.