Transcript for
How to find connection and belonging in tough times

Narrator (00:02): 

Welcome to the Emerging Minds Families podcast. 

Alicia Ranford (Host) (00:05): 

Hi, I’m Alicia Ranford, and you’re listening to an Emerging Minds Families podcast. 

(00:10): 

Before we start the conversation today, we’d like to pay respects to the traditional custodians of the land on which this podcast is recorded, the Kaurna people of the Adelaide Plains. We also pay respect to all Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples, their ancestors and elders past, present, and emerging from the different First Nations across Australia. 

(00:29): 

Today we’ll be touching on the theme of domestic violence, so please, if you feel this may cause you any distress, perhaps give this episode a miss and join us next fortnight. Or you can find some resources for support in the show notes. 

(00:42): 

Connection to people, a place, or culture can make us feel safe, valued, and can enrich our lives. It can also help create a sense of shared experiences and understanding. Most of us have that desire to be connected to someone or something. There’s an inner drive in us that’s seeking out some sense of belonging, a community, or it might be love or acknowledgement. 

(01:05): 

Even though connections can be so valuable, it’s not always easy or straightforward, and there might be things that really get in the way of us building or maintaining those connections we are looking for. And although in some ways we are more connected than ever through our use of technology, many of us can still feel lonely and isolated. 

(01:25): 

Today we are talking to Masha. She’s a mother and migrant who has used connection with spirituality and nature to help her build strength when connection didn’t come easily. She’s going to talk to us today about how when she felt alone, this connection with faith and nature made it easier to connect and build the relationships with others that she was seeking. Welcome Masha, thank you for spending time with us today. 

Masha (Guest) (01:48): 

Thank you for having me. 

Alicia Ranford (Host) (01:49): 

Could you start by telling our listeners a bit about your experience and the time in your life when you really felt the most alone and isolated? 

Masha (Guest) (01:58): 

Yeah, sure. I migrate to Australia on my own. I met my ex-partner here, and because I met him on an early stage, his friend was my friend, so all I know was him, his family, and his friend. And all I knew from Australia and how things work in Australia was through his lens. Because of domestic violence I have to leave him a bit after, and then at that stage I was very alone. I had a little child when I left him, and my child was unwell. And, as I said, I was alone, I was having difficult time, and I just need to survive. 

Alicia Ranford (Host) (02:35): 

And my understanding is that your family weren’t here in Australia with you at that time to provide support. 

Masha (Guest) (02:40): 

I came to Australia on my own. I had a good family, mum, dad, sister, brother, but they were not physically present in Australia. I did talk to them on the phone. 

Alicia Ranford (Host) (02:49): 

And that must’ve been really difficult for you and your son to leave that situation, and that takes a lot of strength. Were there things that made it hard for you to make connection and access support when this happened? 

Masha (Guest) (03:01): 

Yes, it was hard, because, as I said, I didn’t know how things worked in Australia. I was scared of police, doctor, psychologists, any professional appointment that they meant to be helpful for me, I was a bit unsure how I can share my story, how I’ll be safe from them, because my knowledge was from overseas and how things works over there. 

(03:26): 

Also, the other challenge that I had was living on my own with an unwell child. My child was traumatised and I couldn’t put him down to do the simple things even. So it was very challenging. I didn’t have any connection because after moving away from domestic violence relationship I didn’t have any friends because I was afraid of that friend can track me and get my information and that affects my safety. 

Alicia Ranford (Host) (03:52): 

So what I’m hearing is that during that period of time, it was actually almost safer for you to not have those connections. 

Masha (Guest) (03:58): 

Plus culturally I was a bit ashamed of being on my own, like a single mother, and I wasn’t aware of things are different in Australia. My choice at that time was just isolating myself and keeping myself and my child safe. 

Alicia Ranford (Host) (04:13): 

And when you’re on your own like that, I imagine it can be very difficult to do even just the simple things. 

Masha (Guest) (04:19): 

I remember it was midnight and my child had a temperature. I did talk to, on the phone to, I don’t know, SA Health, I just get some advice on the phone and they said that because his temperatures over 39 you have to take him to a hospital. I’m not sure if I had ambulance cover, but at that moment ambulance was not a choice for me, I couldn’t drive because my son was very distressed, he was crying, screaming, he was hot, I couldn’t put him on his car seat. So I called taxi, they didn’t accept to take the child without car seat, it was a big challenge and I didn’t know what to do. So going to the hospital with bus and train at midnight was not an option. I had difficult time, that was just one of the example. 

(05:04): 

And also seeking support I struggled. As I mentioned, I couldn’t trust professionals, so I already had a lot in my plate and there was things coming up because I was not familiar how to do them. I didn’t have experience before that. 

Alicia Ranford (Host) (05:18): 

It makes it very difficult to navigate those circumstances. I know you have an incredible story of determination, and I wonder, could you explain to our listeners what you did during this unbelievably difficult time that really helped you feel more connected when you did feel alone? 

Masha (Guest) (05:34): 

I think what gave me power was my hope and having my child. Giving up was not an option for me because I was responsible for my child. So for my child I told myself that you have to fight, you have to survive, you’re responsible to look after this beautiful human being, so I pray. I had a strong faith, I believe in God, and I pray, and I knew that God will look after. 

(05:57): 

So what I did, I didn’t want my child to show me distress and upset, so I used to put him in a pram and go out for a walk. I remember there was rainy day, I still did that, hot day, I still did that, I put him in a pram and then I pray, and I remember I got emotional, I cry, and then I keep walking. When I come back home I was feeling much better, that stress and anxiety came out of me. I came home, at that moment I lost my appetite, but when I come back home I could eat so I can feed my child. That praying, walking, and oxygen from trees, that helps me a lot. 

(06:34): 

I just want to mention that just not giving up is good. You just don’t give up easily, even if things are that hard that you think you can’t fight anymore, you’re done, you don’t have any more energy, but it’s important to not giving up. 

Alicia Ranford (Host) (06:48): 

Can you tell me a little bit more about why the walking was so important to you? 

Masha (Guest) (06:53): 

I’m an active person. I think when I’m stressed or anxious, exercise or doing something physically helped me to get rid of that feeling. I remember sometimes cleaning the house was helping, just doing something rather than just sitting and thinking, that was difficult. So in the house I used to hold my child, carry him and do things around the house, or going out for a walk and putting him in a pram, so at the same time he can see the nature, he can enjoy looking at the park, street, weather, everything, and I can have my own time. We are still together, but he’s not feeling my pain or he’s not seeing what is my emotion, which I don’t want to share that with him. My child is little. I didn’t want him to stress, and he was unwell. That was a first step without knowing that I’m going to the next step and next step. It was a survival action, but end up giving me a power to go to the next step on my own. 

Alicia Ranford (Host) (07:48): 

It’s really incredible. What difference did it make for you and your son that you did these things to support your own well-being? 

Masha (Guest) (07:55): 

Straight away when I came back home I felt better so I get better appetite, I could eat more better, and I had a better mood to spend time with my child. I was going through a difficult time, but at the same time I thought that having some activity with my child would be very nice, so I joined a music group, infant music group close to my area. I joined and then I initially, first couple of sessions, I saw the other parents, the other mother were talking about things that shows to me that they having perfect life. Their issue is waking up at night to feed their child, or their problem was something nice for me. I couldn’t relate, I couldn’t make friends. 

(08:35): 

But being for an hour on that environment, listening to music, sing a song with my child in that environment makes me feel good and gave me confidence to go to the next level, giving me that pleasure of those moments with my child and I appreciate having him. 

Alicia Ranford (Host) (08:51): 

So the play group that you went to where you didn’t perhaps find that connection that you were looking for, what did you do after that? 

Masha (Guest) (08:59): 

That playgroup didn’t help me directly to connect with other parents, but helped me to build my confidence, helped me to feel like being in that environment is really nice, it’s just giving me some hope to wake up in the morning, get dressed and go to that class. So it just helped me to feel this is good and I want more. 

(09:20): 

So when my child was a bit bigger I went to another group that was a mother group. So that mother group, they asked for gold coin donation. I remember at that time even doing that was a bit of struggle. So I joined couple of sessions, but I talked to the other mother, that was at the time that I was confident enough to have a conversation, and mentioning that I’m a single mother, because before that, based on my own background knowledge of being a single mother is not acceptable in a society, it’s a bit of taboo, people don’t like it. But at that time I was strong enough to mention that, and I was welcomed by other mother and I saw from their facial expression that they accept me, so it was a good moment. I didn’t make friend in the first mother group, but they introduced me to another one and then that one was a very successful one. 

Alicia Ranford (Host) (10:10): 

And what I’m hearing the lesson you learned was that even if the first step didn’t fully meet your needs, it was really important to keep going, taking those small steps and keep going until you found a place that really worked for you and you connected with. 

Masha (Guest) (10:25): 

100%, that’s correct, yes, yes. It’s just, as I said, I didn’t give up. If plan A doesn’t work, I go and did plan B. If plan B didn’t work, I go and try plan C. But as I said, you get energy, you get motivation, you get the positive feedback to give you power to move to the next step. So that was even if that activity or group didn’t connect with other people, but that leads me to next things that helps me. 

Alicia Ranford (Host) (10:52): 

What impact do you think these valuable connections you made have had on your son? 

Masha (Guest) (10:57): 

I believe, as a mother, if I feel better, my son will feel better from looking at me, from feeding him, from every moment that if I’m upset, my child will feel the pain, but if I’m happy, he will feel happy. I think when the child is little they still understand parents’ feeling, so that kind of affect. 

(11:19): 

The other one is that I feel like I could spend more quality time with him and also I could provide better support with taking him to mother group, play group, music group. My child was very little, so these things was available at that time, and even one-on-one time that I spent time with him, playing with him, was good for both of us, not just for my child, for me as well. Just put all the problem aside and then practise puzzle or Lego or something with my little child, that looking at the colour, touching, feeling, seeing my child smile, laughing with him, all those moments was good for both of us. 

Alicia Ranford (Host) (11:59): 

That’s beautiful. 

Masha (Guest) (12:00): 

And that’s connection. Connection with your faith, connection with the nature, connection with music, connection with your child, having your food mindful, any little things that you can’t, connection is not just talking to a friend, connection can be in so many different ways, especially when talking to your friend is not an option. 

Alicia Ranford (Host) (12:20): 

When we’ve spoken previously, you have mentioned that not all connections are positive. Can you tell me a little bit more about that? 

Masha (Guest) (12:27): 

Coming from another country, I can mention that the situation that I was in was a bit unacceptable, and at that time connection with people who are from the same culture could not be very positive because they might judge me. So they might be judgmental, they might give you wrong advice, they might add to your pressure. 

Alicia Ranford (Host) (12:51): 

So connections are not always black and white, are they? 

Masha (Guest) (12:55): 

No. 

Alicia Ranford (Host) (12:55): 

And so for people who are listening today who are struggling to connect with people or places or their community, what would you want them to remember? 

Masha (Guest) (13:04): 

First of all, I want them to know that it’s not always easy, straightforward, and it’s just like this is the number you can call, this is the address you can go and then you find the connection, it’s not like that. It’s got its own difficulty, but it’s important not to give up. Sometimes it’s based on individual needs. Sometimes it works differently for me and it works differently for another person, so they have to find their own way. It’s important to ask, ask for help, and it’s important to see if one way doesn’t work for them they can look for another way, and then another way. It’s not always the second one works, maybe you have to try different things to find your own way of connection. 

Alicia Ranford (Host) (13:44): 

And now that you’re many years further on, how would you describe your connections now? 

Masha (Guest) (13:50): 

Amazing right now. After those mother group I was successful to work, and working was a big step for me because I get my confidence, it was financially helpful, and also give me a feeling that I’m in a society, I’m doing something positive. And after that I start helping people, because helping people who were in my previous situation gives me that feeling that I don’t want anyone else to go through what I went through. 

(14:17): 

I work as a volunteer to help women who are mostly in a similar situation as I was, they were in domestic violence situation, they were having difficulty. They’re from other culture that they don’t know what’s going on in Australia, they don’t know their own right. So those things gives me a lot of power, and now I’ve got a lot of friend, a lot of support, and I’m completely a different person, and I’m glad I didn’t give up at that moment. 

Alicia Ranford (Host) (14:43): 

And what about your son? 

Masha (Guest) (14:44): 

He is very active, thanks God, he’s healthy, he is social, he can talk to other kids, he’s not shy. He’s doing a lot of activity, classes, language, and yeah, he’s a bright child. He’s happy and bright child, and that’s all I want. 

Alicia Ranford (Host) (15:01): 

And it sounds like the strength that it took to build those connections in the early days was hard but worth it in the long run. 

Masha (Guest) (15:11): 

Of course, and I also want to mention it might take time, it’s not just one step. You don’t know how long it takes for each individual, you just need to be patient and never give up. 

Alicia Ranford (Host) (15:22): 

And were there things that you said to yourself to keep going and to keep taking the next step when you still didn’t have the level of connection you were after, were there things that you told yourself to keep going? 

Masha (Guest) (15:35): 

I believe personally my faith helped me a lot. I had a strong belief that God will look after me, I’m doing the right things, that’s why good things will happen to me, no matter how far in the future. But my faith, I’ll say that praying and having faith and believe that God will help me, that was some personal motivation that personally helps me a lot, yeah. 

Alicia Ranford (Host) (15:59): 

And it sounds like from your love of walking and being out and being active, that nature played a really big part in this as well. 

Masha (Guest) (16:07): 

Absolutely. I remember on a rainy day, when it rains I walk without an umbrella so I feel the rain, and that was good, that was amazing. I came back home with, but it just feels great. It feels like I’m fresh, happier. I don’t know if I’m making sense or not, I cry those pain out and they’re out of my body and I can just have a better moment with my child at home. 

Alicia Ranford (Host) (16:32): 

And I really love the way that you described that after you’ve walked and done that healing for yourself, when you got home, it sounds like you were even more able to connect with your son in those moments as well. 

Masha (Guest) (16:45): 

Absolutely. 

Alicia Ranford (Host) (16:46): 

And if listeners were to remember just one thing from our conversation today, what would you want it to be? 

Masha (Guest) (16:52): 

I would like to mention it’s not, as you said, it’s not black and white, it’s different for different individual. For me, walking, connecting to the nature and praying helps a lot. I believe this will help a lot of people, but not necessarily everyone. Some people needs to have a bath and watch TV. I don’t know, it’s just different for different people, but that’s help me a lot. 

Alicia Ranford (Host) (17:17): 

And it sounds like the message you’re giving people is to keep looking until you find the connection that you’re after. 

Masha (Guest) (17:24): 

Correct, yes, correct. 

Alicia Ranford (Host) (17:25): 

I just want to thank you for today’s conversation, Masha, I really value the practical suggestions you’ve given people who might be struggling to find a place within their community to connect with others. 

Masha (Guest) (17:36): 

Thank you so much for giving me this opportunity, that was very nice, thank you. 

Alicia Ranford (Host) (17:40): 

You have been listening to an Emerging Minds Families podcast. If anything spoken about in today’s episode has been distressing for you, or you find struggling, please reach out for help. You can call Lifeline on 13 11 14, or more resources for support can be found in our show notes. 

Narrator (18:02): 

Visit our website at www.emergingminds.com.au/families for a wide range of free information and resources to help support child and family mental health. Emerging Minds leads the National Workforce Centre for Child Mental Health. The Centre is funded by the Australian Government Department of Health under the National Support for Child and Youth Mental Health Program.