Transcript for
Working towards a future without childhood sexual abuse

Alisa Hall (00:00): You don’t need to be a specialist practitioner to help a child, and to help a young person in a disclosure or if you suspect that there is being occurring to a child or young person. One of the key things is actually believing a child. We all have a role in both protecting them, but also supporting them to manage, deal with, and recover and heal from trauma. 

 

Narrator (00:25): Welcome to the Emerging Minds podcast. 

 

Dan Moss (00:31): Welcome, everybody. My name is Dan Moss. I’m delighted to be joined today by Alisa Hall, Director of Practise Development and Engagement at the National Centre for Action on Child Sexual Abuse. Alisa is a social work service leader and executive with 30 years of experience working in violence against women and children, mental health, and community service areas and settings. Along with her clinical work, she has extensive experience leading programmes and initiatives to build the skills and knowledges of practitioners, organisations and sectors to better support and respond to the needs of children, young people, adults, and families. 

 

(01:11): Before we introduce Alisa, we would like to pay respect today to the traditional custodians of the lands on which this podcast is recorded, the Kaurna people of the Adelaide Plains. We also pay respect to all Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples, their ancestors and elders past, present, and emerging from the different First Nations across Australia. And Alisa, welcome. Where are you joining us from today? 

 

Alisa Hall (01:39): I’m joining from Meanjin. I’m in Brisbane in the lands of the Turrbal and Jagera people, so North Brisbane where the sun is shining today. 

 

Dan Moss (01:46): Thanks, Alisa. Can you tell us a little bit about the National Centre for Action on Child Sexual Abuse and your role? 

 

Alisa Hall (01:54): The National Centre for Action on Child Sexual Abuse was established after the Royal Commission, so we’ve been around since the end of late 2021. We are essentially established through a partnership between three leading organisations in Australia, so The Healing Foundation, the Blue Knot Foundation, and the Australian Childhood Foundation. Each of those organisations came together to form a partnership and created a separate entity, which is the National Centre for Action on Child Sexual Abuse as a vehicle really to protect children and support better responses for victims and survivors. 

 

(02:29): I suppose for the National Centre, the why in terms of why we’re here is pretty clear, and that’s that there’s one in three girls and one in five boys experience some form of sexual abuse before the age of 18 in Australia. So the why for us is really clear, and I suppose our purpose in terms of an organisation is to really support, a focus on protecting children, of course from harm before it begins, but also on how we support children, young people, and adults really to heal and recover from the impacts of child sexual abuse, which they carry across their life. 

 

(03:08): My role at the National Centre is Director of Practise Development and Engagement. And so amongst that range of activities that I oversee is around developing knowledge resources, so how might we provide information and knowledge to different practitioners and workforce groups providing professional learning and education type activities. So both online on demand activities as well as workshops and webinars, but also how we might influence the service system where workers operate, so how we support organisations as well. 

 

(03:43): I suppose just on that, one of the whys also for us is in the early days of a year and a half ago, we undertook a Learning and Development Survey trying to understand really what practitioners and workers needed or were concerned about in terms of their knowledge and their learning in working with victims and survivors or understanding child sexual abuse. There was about 1400 respondents in that survey, so really strong response rate. It was 91% of people who completed that survey and who had undertaken formal study told us that they really did not feel equipped through their formal study to support children, young people, or adults who’ve experienced child sexual abuse. For us, that’s a really big call to action in terms of how we assist those workers and practitioners in really different areas. 

 

(04:36): That’s probably the other thing that I would mention is that the work that we do really thinks about practitioners broadly, not necessarily just a sector in terms of child sexual abuse. It’s really all about responsibilities as workers who come into contact with children and young people, that we all have a role in protecting children and young people, not just specialist workforces and specialist practitioners. We all have a role in both protecting them but also supporting them to manage, deal with, and recover and heal from trauma. 

 

Dan Moss (05:07): That’s really fascinating. Practitioners are really telling you, Alisa, that they acknowledge this role that they have in allowing children to tell their stories, whatever those stories might be, but that occasionally they’re feeling like they’re lacking the confidence or the skills to be able to do that. 

 

Alisa Hall (05:24): That’s right, and I think we’ve recently, and I can talk a little bit more, but we’ve recently undertaken a community attitude study, a fairly large population-based survey, which was about the community’s attitudes. Not necessarily just workers, but that reinforced really the essence of what you’ve just said there about confidence. Confidence and capability, feeling like they have the capability really to create the safe space to allow children and young people to tell their story in whatever way that they tell it because it isn’t always going to be told in a nice, neat story in a verbal way. But also not only the confidence to hear it, but then the confidence to act. We are certainly hearing from workers and practitioners that that’s an area that they really don’t feel that they are confident and capable in. 

 

Dan Moss (06:13): Yeah. Alisa, a lot’s made at the moment around organisations and practitioners using a trauma-informed practise framework, but are there specific skills and competencies that practitioners need to know and be able to practise specifically about children where child sexual abuse has occurred as opposed to other traumas? 

 

Alisa Hall (06:35): Yeah, it’s difficult, isn’t it, Dan? I mean, I think the answer is yes, yes and no. The core tenets of trauma-informed care and practise hold in terms of any child development and child trauma of which child sexual abuse most certainly is one. I suppose the things that I would particularly emphasise around child sexual abuse is there is immense shame, self-blame, and stigma that children carry who are experiencing child sexual abuse, or who have, that messaging around that it’s somehow their fault that they might’ve done something wrong, that they’ve created it. So this immense shame and secrecy and stigma is a big part of child sexual abuse. 

 

(07:22): Also, that it often occurs in terms of a incredible violation of a relationship of safety in a relationship and often in a family relationship. Thinking about all of those things, the impact that those things have on a young person and their development, I really just underline those tenets around safety, trust, and transparency in terms of working with children and young people. When that safety and that trust has been so fractured, it’s very, very difficult for children and young people to be able to figure out where a safe environment is for them to be able to get the help that they desperately need. 

 

(08:03): I’d really underpin the children feeling safe is the essence, I suppose, of a trauma-informed approach and certainly within the context of child sexual abuse so that they’re able to access the support that they need. I think the other really interesting point to talk about in this area around trauma-informed care and workers is, as you’ve said, workers have and are growing, but certainly a good understanding of trauma-informed care now in many areas and one of the things that’s important to remember with working with child sexual abuse is to not be overwhelmed by the sexual nature of the trauma. I think that’s something that we hear that people tend to feel like it is just out of their skill set, out of their knowledge, out of their area of confidence and capability. There’s a tendency to turn away because of the sexual nature of the trauma, and really, I suppose we would encourage people to remember that working in a trauma-informed way, they have those skills, they have the ability to create safety so it’s about leaning in and not turning away really from the nature of it. 

 

Dan Moss (09:17): In your work with practitioners, what have you found that’s been helpful in terms of supporting practitioners to be able to do this, to be able to stick with a conversation or a disclosure from a child where they might be naming some quite graphic details of what’s happened for them? 

 

Alisa Hall (09:35): I think a couple of the things are really from when we were speaking just before is that you don’t need to be a specialist practitioner to help a child and to help a young person in a disclosure or if you suspect that there is being occurring to a child or young person. And really, one of the key things is about actually believing a child. So if a child or a young person is able to find the words to talk to you, and I think that’s the other really important thing to talk about with disclosure is that we know from what victims and survivors have told us for a long time, and we know from the growing evidence base that disclosure is a process. 

 

(10:17): It doesn’t necessarily, and quite often, particularly for children and young people happen in one neat bundle where they will come and tell you their story in a really clear, neat way. It happens in bits and pieces, it could be put out and taken back. It’s really important to understand that that’s the nature of disclosure, that it won’t all occur… It could occur in little bits and pieces, and it’s different depending on age and stage in terms of the child and the young person as well. 

 

(10:49): But really, I think the overwhelming advice is the importance of believing a child when they do talk to you about disclosure or they do try to share. We know from victims and survivors and the growing evidence base is that if the power of a child or a young person being believed in terms of their ability to heal, recover, and to get that help for the behaviour to stop, which is ultimately what we are looking for as well, is incredibly powerful. So the ability for a worker or a practitioner to be a part by simply believing credibility in that child is incredibly powerful to then how the child’s able to continue to manage and heal and recover over time. So believing I think is really a key message. 

 

(11:38): The other, I suppose things that we talk about are around managing self and being calm even if you don’t feel calm, but being quite calm in terms of your own behaviour because you are trying to create calm and safety for a young person or a child who isn’t feeling calm and isn’t feeling safe. I think managing your own self, managing your own responses, including your body language, including the way that your eyes look, all of those kinds of things. But it is also about then taking action and transparency with the child or a young person in doing that. The caveat of course is we’re talking about children and young people like they’re all the same, but of course it’s really different depending on different ages and stages of development. But they’re some of the key things that we talk about. 

 

Dan Moss (12:26): Alisa, you mentioned there that some children or young people might, it might not be a linear process for them to disclose, and in fact, for an adult in their lives, they might be checking out over a period of time whether this adult is someone that will be okay, actually will believe them. And so what can practitioners do to actually provide those messages that they will believe, but they’re also someone that it’s worth sharing these stories with? 

 

Alisa Hall (12:53): I think it’s a really important point to underline, and we know from the evidence that actually a great number of children, young people don’t disclose actually. The Royal Commission tells us and amongst the other evidence tells us actually the average timeframe for people to child sexual abuse is 28 years, so there is an awful lot of children and young people who don’t disclose, and may never disclose. That’s an important thing to understand. I guess understanding that makes it even more imperative really for us to be a safe enough person and a safe enough environment so that a child or young person will actually let you in and will actually allow the story to come out. I think just underlying really what you’ve said, Dan, that it isn’t particularly with children and young people, and it won’t always necessarily be a verbal depending on how young a child is. 

 

(13:49): I think some of the things that practitioners particularly can do is also know the signs. Be alert, be aware, and lean in I suppose, and curious and lean in terms of the behaviour in what a child and young person is telling you so that they feel compelled, and I suppose safe to be able to tell you and to be able to talk to you. I think the notion of being curious and asking the question is a really important, and it’s not necessarily a front-on question, but asking questions that create a relationship and safety are really some of the things that we would be talking to practitioners about regardless of where they sit in the service system, all practitioners could do that. 

 

Dan Moss (14:33): You talked a little bit before about the overwhelming shame and stigma that children can feel, and of course this can obviously come from perpetrators having them feel that the abuse was part of a relationship that was on an even keel, and of course this hides power imbalances from children. Now obviously power is not something that children are used to or conditioned to talk about in our society. Are there things that practitioners, or are there ways that practitioners can make power overt with children in their services that might encourage disclosures or different ways of thinking about their abuse? 

 

Alisa Hall (15:11): Yeah, again, a really good question, and I think understanding grooming and what grooming means and what grooming looks like is a really important thing for practitioners to be aware of and to do and be insidious nature of grooming and how it can be really difficult, particularly for young people and adolescents to really be able to understand and for workers to be able to understand when a behaviour is a grooming behaviour, because it’s a behaviour that often makes adolescents feel special. It does make them feel special, it does make them feel safe. 

 

(15:51): It often is around children who are craving and young people craving that safety craving, that specialness craving, that special type of behaviour of which perpetrators and those who are grooming young people do. That’s an intentioned, manipulated behaviour that’s part of child sexual abuse. So I think, one, the first thing is really very much to be alert to the fact that it occurs. Really, I guess going back to those basic tenets of being curious, looking for the signs and the indicators that there is harm occurring, even if it’s not your job as a practitioner isn’t to find the evidence. It isn’t to dig and dig and dig and find the definitive evidence that something’s occurring. It’s to create the opportunity for a young person or a child to be able to tell you and confide and talk to you and share that, and that is by breaking that power imbalance. So it is by allowing them to have the power to share that story. 

 

Dan Moss (16:51): Yeah, really interesting. Thanks, Alisa. You mentioned before that you’ve recently released some findings about attitudes across Australia to child sexual abuse. What did you find? Are we moving in the right directions? Are attitudes changing? 

 

Alisa Hall (17:06): In some ways, there are both areas and the Australian Child Maltreatment Study tells us as well there’s some improvements, but there’s an incredibly long way to go. Actually, the prevalence in the statistics as we mentioned before are startling, absolutely incredibly startling. One in three girls and one in five boys. But in terms of the survey, a couple of the key messages that I think are really interesting to talk about is that the community’s awareness through this study, we found that their awareness of child sexual abuse was actually really quite high so it was quite close to what we think the prevalence numbers are. 

 

(17:46): But the interesting thing was what a great many of those, whilst they had an awareness of child sexual abuse, they didn’t think that it was an issue that they needed to worry about. About a third of them felt that they weren’t directly impacted by child sexual abuse. So when we look at those statistics and we hear one in three girls, one in five boys, what we know without question is that child sexual abuse happens in every community across Australia. No one is immune from it. I think it’s really interesting for us to understand at a community level that people have an awareness, but they still have a distancing. They don’t think it’s necessarily something that they need to be concerned about or that is occurring in the area, in their workforce, in their network, in their neighbourhood. I think firstly, that’s really interesting for us in terms of what does that tell us about what we have to do in terms of helping the community. 

 

(18:38): Another message that I think particularly for young people is a continued victim blaming attitudes towards victims of child sexual abuse, and I think particularly for adolescents and young people, that’s incredibly concerning. About 40% of respondents had victim blaming attitudes towards older children and their ability to responsibly and actively resist adult sexual advances. So those attitudes, those entrenched attitudes are really problematic and concerning. And about 12% had views that adolescent girls wearing clothing were asking to be sexually abused, so those entrenched victim blaming attitudes are other things that are really important, I think for us to lean into. There was also a couple of other messages were around some community members really don’t believe or they’re uncertain if they should believe children when they disclose. The credibility of children is not something that all people inherently believe in. There is this questioning of credibility and this questioning of belief that continues to happen so that wasn’t the majority, but certainly was an attitude that we really need to try to combat. 

 

Dan Moss (19:55): Yeah, it was really interesting, and even the most knowledgeable and skilled practitioners will talk about those invitations to downplay a child’s story, or to think maybe a child’s getting it wrong or to want to reword what a child said. These are invitations that it seems like really skilled practitioners are constantly having to think about and critically examine in the context of their own work. 

 

Alisa Hall (20:21): Yeah, I think that’s absolutely true, Dan, and I think it’s interesting around the pressure or the influence almost to only believe if everything lines up in a row or all of these stories clear, all of the evidence lines up, and we know very clearly a whole range of things, but we know one of them is about children and young people in particular will often recant their story. Now, that doesn’t mean that they’re not telling the truth. 

 

(20:50): There’s lots of different reasons for that. There is fear of safety, fear of repercussions and reprisal. Disclosing child sexual abuse for a child or a young person is an incredibly risky endeavour. The consequences on disclosing child sexual abuse, whilst on one hand the consequence is to get help and to stop the behaviour, the consequence on the other hand is to severely impact your family, your relationships, your connection to community, your health, your physical health, your mental health. So the consequences of actually disclosing are really high for a young person. 

 

(21:31): We need to be aware of all of those things as many of those things as we come to be a part of how they can find recovery and healing and support and help and safety as part of disclosing and the response to disclosing, because I think that’s the other thing to remember for practitioners is it’s not just the disclosure, it’s not just the immediate disclosure. It’s what happens then. The disclosure in many ways is the beginning of that next part of that journey, and so remembering that workers have a role and a responsibility that actually goes far beyond the disclosure. 

 

Dan Moss (22:09): And of course, these messages that children, young people are naturally adults are providing us through their lived experiences, they’re not new messages, are they? They’ve been quite consistent for a long time. I know one of the pieces of work that you do at the Centre is engaging with people with lived experience to try to move forward with practises that support children. 

 

Alisa Hall (22:32): Yeah, absolutely, Dan. To underline your comment, these are not new things that victims and survivors tell us. The Royal Commission and many other investigations in states and territories have an incredible amount of testimony and experience and stories where victims and survivors have told us and told us and told us about their journey, the incredible impact that child sexual abuse has on their entire life. I think we do have to listen to victims and survivors. The National Centre tries to do that, and many organisations, I think it’s important to acknowledge I think really do try to do that, do try to listen. That’s critical because victims and survivors are the experts of their life, their story. 

 

(23:21): One of the things we talk about at the National Centre is this notion of the different knowledge sources that are important for us to bring together if we are to learn and change. We talk about five knowledge sources that we talk about academic evidence. We talk about lived experience, knowledge and expertise, and we talk about practise and procedural wisdom and cultural knowledge and wisdom and how it’s our job almost to bring all of those lenses together to synthesise those and think about all of the things that we learn from. 

 

(23:54): So not just evidence, but evidence, experience, expertise, how we bring all of those things together, and then create guidance and create knowledge that actually is going to help people to change behaviour because that’s ultimately what we’re looking for, and that’s ultimately what victims of survivors are looking for. They’ve told us for a long time that after an experience of child sexual abuse, a traumatic, which is not one experience, we know that child sexual abuse most often is multiple abuses, a series of abuse, and the victims and survivors have told us many times that trauma is often compounded when they enter the service system because of a whole range of things. 

 

(24:37): Some in terms of the way that practitioners and workers either do or don’t work in a trauma-informed way, but also all of the restrictions that we know that make organisations sometimes hard to engage with, so there’s criteria and there’s geographical locations and sometimes there’s funding restrictions. There’s an awful lot of barriers for victims and survivors accessing the service system as well, so listening to that and thinking about how we create access and how we learn from what they’re telling us is important, and it’s one of the things that National Centre’s really trying hard to do. 

 

Dan Moss (25:12): Some practitioners talk to us about receiving multiple referrals from children because of school refusal. The prime motivation for working with a child might be because they’re not going to school, or that they’re misbehaving at school, or that they’re engaging in other risk factor. They talk about the room or the space that they require or the authorising environments to be able to spend a little bit more time on children or young people’s experiences of trauma. Is this something that you have done a lot of thinking on? 

 

Alisa Hall (25:45): Yeah, look, I think it’s incumbent, it’s a really interesting obligation in many ways, but for us working in this space, a National Centre, but all of the partners and others doing incredible work and for a long time in this space to think about how we create a systems level change because there’s certainly work we need to do to support workers and practitioners and to support organisations and their systems, but there is also work to enable the organisations and workers to work differently, and that really is about how we tune in and try to really shift the system level barriers and education is a really great one. 

 

(26:26): But in terms of the education environment, teachers and educators do a fabulous job. Quite often they are trying to cope with an incredible level of activity, but also trauma that’s happening for different people in different ways. They’re trying to do that and teach their curricular and educate and keep people safe, and it’s an incredibly challenging environment. I think when we’re talking about young people and things like the growing acknowledgement and understanding around harmful sexual behaviour so behaviours that are harmful between young people, often that’s something that schools are really grappling with how they manage and how they cope. 

 

Dan Moss (27:06): Yeah. Do you think there’s an increased appetite for change currently in the society? I mean, you mentioned before the Australian Childhood Maltreatment Study, not to mention some of the work that you are doing that you’ve mentioned around attitudes towards child sexual abuse. Are you feeling positive about the environment for change? 

 

Alisa Hall (27:26): Look, I think yes, I think there is enormous potential. There’s certainly enormous effort focus in the Australian context in lots of different ways. So both in an online and an offline context, we have the National Office for Child Safety, and the National Strategy. We have departments like the Australian Centre, the ACE, as well as the Office for eSafety, looking at particularly online safety for children and young people. So I think there is an incredible amount of activity occurring, and I do feel hopeful. I think one of the challenges for us systemically is to think about how we coordinate our approaches, because the reality is children and young people need things to be joined up, because it’s their life, and they need our systems to be joined up so that they can navigate what they need easily. So I think that’s probably the biggest challenge. One of the biggest challenges for us is how do we coordinate the effort across all of the systems that children and young people enter into or access or need to get support from. So absolutely hopeful, but lots more to do. 

 

Dan Moss (28:33): What is it that you think practitioners can do to bring to the fore the great many stories of resistance or resilience or courage or connection for others that many children and young people or all in fact have experienced? How can practitioners bring these stories into the spotlight along with the problems or effects that have been created by the abuse? 

 

Alisa Hall (28:57): I think that’s a really important thing for us to remember is that there is a great level of strength and power and resilience in children and young people and victims and survivors more broadly that we can learn from, so highlighting and understanding the stories. I think learn from the stories, learn from the stories and the information that we hear from people. But I also think it’s important for us to remember that every individual is different, and workers and practitioners, it’s important for us to remember that the individual in front of us is not necessarily going to react the same way another individual or a young person has reacted. I think it’s also to keep leaning in and to keep leaning into the individual stories. But I also think it’s about a public narrative. It is about a community dialogue and a professional dialogue. 

 

(29:47): We do know that we had, was telling somebody a story the other day where I was writing down the name of the National Centre for Action on Child Sexual Abuse. Someone had written it back to me and taken out the word sexual and had just written the National Centre for Action on Child Abuse, so we know that people are uncomfortable in the space. I suppose for workers and practitioners, it’s to really encourage them to lean in because if they can’t find a way to sit with it, how can children and young people find safety in them? 

 

Dan Moss (30:17): You talked before about the narrative or the community or national, if you will, narrative around the issue of child sexual abuse. But what are a couple of directions that you’d really like to see that narrative go into in the future? 

 

Alisa Hall (30:33): Yeah, look, I think leveraging off what we know and what we’ve learned from the ACMS data from our Community Attitudes study, the National Office of Child Safety has also done a public campaign, One Talk at a Time campaign. I suppose leveraging off all of those things, one of the things that we would talk about is the importance of actually having the community dialogue, not buffering down the community dialogue. So actually keeping it in the spotlight is one thing that’s really important. The Royal Commission was a number of years ago now, so it’s keeping it in the spotlight is important. I think the next thing in terms of the community messaging is about response. How do we help people be confident to actually respond and act in a compassionate way, in a child-centred and child-led way, but how do we actually get people to actually act and to not look away? 

 

(31:26): I think that those things are really keen for people to be able to do. I think the other thing is about helping people who understand that it’s everybody’s business to keep children and young people safe. It’s everybody’s business. It’s not the business of specialist practitioners only, not the business only of police. It’s everybody’s business. We are bystanders. We are all in the community. We all have a responsibility, and ultimately it’s an adult’s job to keep a child safe. It’s not a child’s job to keep themselves safe, it’s an adult’s job to do that. 

 

(31:57): So how do we allow people to be active community members in many ways? Because we still live in environment and a community and a dialogue where there is, that’s behind closed doors, and that’s a matter and a family environment and people don’t get involved. That still exists in the Australian community, so how do we help people to understand that it is their business? 

 

(32:18): I suppose that probably the fourth thing is really going back to the comment that we were talking about for around victim blaming and particularly for adolescents. Those entrenched views that community, and we are all community members, hold, and the responsibility we put on young people to look after their own safety, to be responsible for their own safety at the hands of adults is something we have to really challenge. 

 

Dan Moss (32:43): Yeah, that’s really great advice. Alisa, you talked before about making sure that we treat every child as an individual, and every child’s story is unique within trauma-informed lenses. How can practitioners make sure that they’re not becoming overwhelmed by the lists of effects that might be experienced within children’s bodies and brains and actually take the time to listen to the complexity and the uniqueness of their story? 

 

Alisa Hall (33:12): It’s a good question. I think some of it, there’s multiple paths to it, and certainly some of it is about managing self. So some of it is about being able to manage yourselves at your nervous system, and which we’re asking children and young people, that’s what they’re trying to do, manage their self and their nervous systems which are completely out of control. We need workers and practitioners to be able to do that for themselves, to be able to have a calm, safe body and mind because that helps a child or a young person to be able to have a calm and safe body and mind. 

 

(33:44): I think thinking about the impacts on workers is really important as well, so thinking about going to use vicarious trauma, but also thinking about burnout and fatigue, understanding the impacts that working with children and young people who are experiencing trauma is having on you is really important for you to be able to manage your own behaviour, and the way that you’ve been able to interact with children and young people. I think having an insight to the impact it’s having on you actually is helping children and young people. I guess we should be talking about that, I think probably more than we are. 

 

(34:22): The other thing I think, Dan, that’s really important to talk about, and we did mention it, but certainly that children and young people are different. And that they have different experiences, and they have different environments, and they have different families, and they have different contexts, and they have different cultures, and they have different levels of vulnerability, and all of those things are playing out in the child or young person that’s sitting in front of you. 

 

Dan Moss (34:49): Alisa Hall, Director for Practise Development Engagement from the National Centre for Action on Child Sexual Abuse, thank you so much for joining us today. I think everyone will agree that that’s been a really insightful and engaging conversation. It sounds like there’s lots of work being done in this space, but there’s lots of work still to be done and some really great, I think advice and encouragement for practitioners within that conversation to be listening to children’s stories, and to be remembering that keeping children safe is everyone’s business. Alisa, thank you so much for joining us today. 

 

Alisa Hall (35:24): Thanks for having me, Dan. It’s been great to chat. 

 

Dan Moss (35:26): It’s been such a privilege talking with Alisa today. If you would like to know more about the work of the National Centre, you can find them on nationalcentre.org, and if you’re a practitioner looking for some advice on working with children who have experienced child sexual abuse, please have a look at the Emerging Minds course, Supporting Children Who Disclose Trauma. Thank you all for joining me today, can’t wait to speak with you next time. 

 

Narrator (35:53): Visit our website at emergingminds.com.au to access a range of resources to assist your practise. Brought to you by the National Workforce Centre for Child Mental Health. Led by Emerging Minds, the Centre is funded by the Australian Government Department of Health and Aged Care under the National Support for Child and Youth Mental Health Program.