Transcript for
Young carers and how to support them

VO (00:02):

Welcome to the Emerging Minds Families Podcast.

Nadia Rossi (Host) (00:05):

Hi, I’m Nadia Rossi and you are listening to an Emerging Minds Families Podcast. We would like to pay respect to the traditional custodians of the land on which this podcast is recorded, the Kaurna people of the Adelaide Plains. We also pay respect to all Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples, their ancestors and elders past, present and emerging from the different First Nations across Australia.

(00:27):

In Australia, there are nearly 400,000 young people under the age of 25 who provide unpaid care and support to a loved one. There are many reasons why a parent or friend might require ongoing car., and when a young person takes on this role, it can be difficult to recognise when they might need support themselves.

(00:44):

In today’s episode, we are speaking to Isabella Hassall, Young Carer coordinator at Carer Gateway for the Benevolent Society. Isabella is here today to talk about the often hidden carers in our community, young carers. How the adults in their life can support them and what opportunities are available for them to access. Welcome Isabella, it is great to speak with you today.

Isabella Hassall (Guest) (01:05):

Thank you so much, Nadia. It is a real privilege to be joining you today.

Nadia Rossi (Host) (01:09):

At Emerging Minds Families, we acknowledge families come in many forms. So I was wondering if we started today’s conversation by you telling us a bit about who makes up your family?

Isabella Hassall (Guest) (01:19):

Such a lovely question to begin with. I have a wonderful family. I’ve got my two parents, my mum and my dad, and then I’ve got two younger brothers. I often call them my baby brothers, but the youngest is 23, so I don’t know if I can still say that. But I also come from a really big extended family, so I’ve got lots of aunties and uncles and lots and lots of first cousins and second cousins, but I’ve got 16 first cousins. So very big and loving family, so I’m very lucky.

Nadia Rossi (Host) (01:48):

Thank you for sharing that. Sounds like you have a amazing village around you. Isabella, from your experience, what is a young carer and how do they differ to an adult who provides support to someone they love?

Isabella Hassall (Guest) (02:01):

We see young carers as anyone that’s 25 and under that are in what we call an unpaid caring role for someone that they love. So a loved one in their life that might have a disability or a mental health condition, maybe a life limiting health or medical condition. A drug or alcohol related condition, may be frail due to older age, so lots of different things.

(02:22):

And often in their life, which I guess makes them a little bit different from adult carers, generally it might be a sibling that they care for, it might be a parent. Sometimes it’s a grandparent or an aunt or uncle, but most commonly we work with people that are caring for their siblings or a parent.

Nadia Rossi (Host) (02:38):

Isabella, I was wondering if an adult, perhaps an educator or grown up in a young person’s life notices they might be caring for someone, what is the best way to start a conversation with that young person and check in and just see what support they might need?

Isabella Hassall (Guest) (02:53):

I think the best way is generally to just talk about … Maybe gently explain what a young carer is. For lot of people they might not even know that’s a thing, that young carers are a thing to be acknowledged. So even just explaining what a caring role might look like and that it can look different for lots of different people and just really acknowledging that they’ve seen that maybe there is an extra responsibility for that young person.

(03:17):

Maybe they see that they walk to school with their sibling that has a disability and they might just say, “Hey, do you do extra stuff around the home for them?” And maybe it’s a parent or whatever they’ve seen and just sort of gently acknowledging as much as they can and asking if they feel like they might resonate with this thing or this title of being a young carer. And then more importantly, asking if there’s anything that they need help with around that or anything that they just need inside or out of the caring role.

(03:44):

Just really talking to them about the fact that they might be a young carer or even just acknowledging sometimes it’s first off just talking about someone else that’s a young carer and saying, “Hey, when I was growing up, one of my friends had a parent with a disability and they used all these kind of things and they ended up getting support. Maybe that’s something that maybe you think about that and let me know if I can help you to find some support for you.”

Nadia Rossi (Host) (04:09):

That’s really a great way of phrasing it because it opens up that idea to that young person that they’re not alone. I feel like from what I understand, it can be quite isolating. They may not feel like other people are in a similar situation. So starting that conversation by, “I used to know someone. I’ve seen someone carrying out this role before,” that kind of immediately makes that person feel like they’re not alone.

Isabella Hassall (Guest) (04:32):

Even more so if they can relate it to other people that they might know. Even their friends or we’ve got another student … If it’s a teacher, one of the other students is doing this for their sibling. Does that sound like something that you’re doing? And we’re helping them in this way, maybe we can do the same for you.

Nadia Rossi (Host) (04:48):

Isabella, what supports are available to young carers and how do they access them?

Isabella Hassall (Guest) (04:52):

So there’s lots of different supports. There are emotional supports, so that can include things like counselling, completely free counselling, which is more about working through their emotions and how they’re feeling about the role that they’re in, coaching, which is a really good way for them to work on a goal in a one-on-one space and then that might be helping them to do the other things that they want to do outside of the caring role.

(05:14):

We’ve got peer support, which is a really great way to meet up with other young carers. And as you touched on before, just make sure that they know that they’re not alone and so they’re kind of like the … I like to look at it as sort of two umbrellas, emotional support and then practical support. So they might be able to access things like free driving lessons, maybe tutoring or educational supports for people that are doing a bit more of a primary carer role.

(05:36):

They might be able to access some personal care in the home or get some respite to really help them hands-on in that caring space. And these are all sort of provided by all the different local providers across Australia. So it’s really dependent on where you’re based, the services that are available. The good news is that Carer Gateway is a nationwide service, so I think that that’s probably the best way to start accessing it.

(05:59):

You can call the 1800 number, it’s 1800 422 737 and so they can call that from wherever they’re based and they’ll be automatically linked with their local call service provider. And then once you get talking to someone there, then they will hopefully be able to show you the different ways that you can access support, including your local supports. The other one that is really good for young carers is the Young Carer Network, which is through Carers Australia.

(06:23):

And similarly, that is a website that shows you all the different supports that might be available to you. So depending on where you are, there’s other sort of additional things on top of Carer Gateway and so that’s really good. That also includes a young carer bursary, which is an amount of money that you can apply for that goes straight to your bank account, so that’s to help you with all the additional things that you might need in your education or in the caring role.

(06:47):

There are also things through Centrelink that you might be able to access, so real practical supports again, so that might be like a carer’s payment or a carer’s allowance. So it’s definitely good to look into that. Obviously acknowledging that they often means tested and you have to sort of show your residency or citizenship. So that’s sort of something to be aware of for both, the bursary and for Centrelink. But through Carer Gateway or their supports are open to anyone no matter your residency, Visa, refugee status, no matter what you’ve got. If you’re living in Australia, you can get access through Carer Gateway.

Nadia Rossi (Host) (07:18):

Thank you for sharing that. It’s not widely known the amount of supports that can be available and maybe someone that is listening that has a young carer caring for them or a young carer that is listening is now aware of those. So I wanted to touch on shame and stigma that can be associated with a young carer in the young carer role. So can there be shame and stigma that young carers experience? And what are some of the difficulties you see that you young carers deal with?

Isabella Hassall (Guest) (07:48):

Unfortunately, the answer is yes. We do see young people that are having experiences with shame and stigma. I think it’s really interesting because we have come such a long way, I think, as a society in terms of attitudes towards people with additional needs or disabilities, but it can still be really hard for young people to not be feeling that when maybe they’ve had negative experiences at school with bullying, which is just awful. But it does happen sometimes, unfortunately.

(08:15):

But then it also happens when they might not even be having been bullied or anything, but they’re just feeling that in themselves. They might be maybe uncomfortable about bringing friends over to their house because they’ve got a sibling that has really challenging behaviours that they need a bit more support around. And I know growing up, that’s a really big part of childhood is having your friends over, playing with them and doing that kind of thing. So I think the shame sort of affects young people there.

(08:41):

I think that they also might want to hide and even not try to interact with young people, so with their friends or their peers and keep themselves a little bit hidden and out of sight, out of mind. So that can be really tricky. I think sort of tied in with the shame and stigma can also be a bit of guilt around wanting to advocate for their own needs. I think I see this a lot with siblings who they’ve got a sibling or even multiple siblings with additional needs and they don’t want to be an additional challenge or difficulty or stress for their parents.

(09:17):

So they don’t talk about their own needs, they don’t talk about what they’re going through. We see it a lot, unfortunately. Kids will be falling really far behind at school, but they’re not talking to their parents about it. They’re not talking about how they’re feeling emotionally because they know that their parents or their parent or whoever is the other carer in their life is so busy with their sibling or whoever it is that they’re caring for, that they just feel really guilty about ever putting their hand up and saying that they need help as well. So that’s a really big one.

(09:47):

I think it’s also worth noting that, for some people, shame around asking for help is a really big one as well. And I think, in my experience, that can be even more so apparent in culturally and linguistically diverse families just due to different cultural backgrounds that might have different feelings around asking for help. So that’s a really big one as well. So it is a challenge that we face with our young carers and I think that’s where those emotional supports can really come in handy to help them work through those and hopefully get to the other side.

Nadia Rossi (Host) (10:17):

Thank you for sharing that. Isabella, how have you seen some of the young carers you’ve worked with overcome these difficulties?

Isabella Hassall (Guest) (10:24):

Well, the good news is, as well, that I’ve seen this and that’s so amazing to watch some of the transformation. I think one of those is the emotional supports that are offered through Carer Gateway, but also through other providers, sort of local providers. So things like counselling to help them work through those feelings of shame and stigma and guilt and all sorts of different feelings that they may be having towards their friends, but also towards the person that they’re caring for.

(10:49):

That’s worth acknowledging that, that can be really hard as well, particularly for young people who for a lot of them they’ve just grown up with that. I think coaching as well can be really good to make sure that they are able to still focus on their own goals and think about what’s going to be helpful for them in the future. And to be honest, in my opinion, the peer support events that we run, and I know that other providers run them as well.

(11:12):

All most important because that is a space for them to meet other young carers and build connections with people who have had a really similar experience to them and just building those relationships. And most importantly, I think you touched on it at the top, knowing that they’re not alone is such a big one. I have an example of one kid that we worked with when he first came to our programme. He and his mum sort of told us that he was getting bullied a lot at school and was having a really, really tough time at school, didn’t really have any friends, was feeling in a pretty low spot when he started high school.

(11:45):

He started coming along to the events that we run. He came and only even took a few events where he met up with other young people who have similar experiences to him. He formed such good connections, I think, just in that knowledge that, hey, this kid here also has a sibling with a disability or also has a parent that needs extra support to the point that his mum has since called us and said he’s now getting invited to birthday parties, which didn’t happen in his first year of high school and now he is.

(12:13):

And he’s getting invited to go around to people’s houses and, yeah, we like to claim that that was a lot of the confidence that he found in the Young Carer Community to be honest. That’s one that we’re really proud of, but there’s so many other examples, as well, of very similar stories.

Nadia Rossi (Host) (12:28):

It’s just so wonderful to hear that and being around other young carers and kind of building that community and they’re meant to have people that understand your situation and that you feel safe with. So those peer supported events sound like it is just building that village and that community around young carers.

Isabella Hassall (Guest) (12:47):

It’s almost the best part is when we get to step away from it because we’ve seen that they have … Their parents have got each other’s numbers, they’ve added each other on social media, they’re going to be hanging out and even if they don’t necessarily live super close, they have got each other. There’s lots of different things to say about social media, but there’s such good ways for them to connect and know that there’s someone else. And even if it’s just one friend that they make that has a similar background, then it’s really special to see that.

Nadia Rossi (Host) (13:18):

Even just having that phone number to send a text or a message and just check in. Connections when things may be difficult at home, to know they have that connection and that understanding with someone else or another family, I think, is just so invaluable. Isabella, what strengths do you see in the young carers that you’ve worked with and what are some of the skills or attributes they develop through their caring role that you’ve seen?

Isabella Hassall (Guest) (13:41):

There are so many. It’s amazing to see these young people that are so beyond their years. I think patience and empathy are really, really big ones. I think advocacy is a really big one. We see them standing up for the people that they love and that extends past just their care recipient. It extends to the other people or we see them standing up for their friends that they’ve just met, and so that’s a really big one. I think that they can be really organised and be really good problem solvers because they’ve had to in their own lives.

(14:12):

They can be really creative problem solvers, just finding out ways that they can help the person that they love through different trials and challenges. They are really good at staying calm in a crisis. Particularly we see that from a really young age, as well, that they know how to be really confident in supporting others, especially with emotional needs. And a lot of them have a really good understanding of mental health.

(14:36):

Again, just beyond their years because they’ve had to. And as you said, it’s something they’ve developed without even realising and it’s things that adults have to go to skills workshops to do that sort of stuff. And these young people are just doing it because of the household that they’ve grown up in and how they’ve had to help the person that they love. I think even just having the skills and the knowledge of different health issues and how to navigate health systems.

(15:03):

We see this a lot in people that are, what we call, a primary carer. So they might be caring for their parents. Often there might be a single parent and the child or children are often the oldest child is doing a lot to support that parent through navigating, making sure that they’re getting to hospital, making sure they’re getting to their appointments, making sure they’re taking their medications, that sort of thing that a lot of other people their age just would have no idea about.

(15:29):

Maturity, obviously, is a really big one. And it’s interesting because we often hear parents talking about it as kind of a negative impact of the caring role that they’ve had to grow up too quickly. But honestly, I see it as a massive strength and we often see them become really great leaders. In fact, and I’m sure my team won’t remind me saying this, some of the people that I work with have had experience as young carers themselves when they were younger, and they’re just such wonderful leaders now because they’re still really young, but they’re just incredible at what they do and incredible at supporting people.

(16:00):

And you go, “Yeah, this is because of your experience from years and years ago.” And so that’s a really big one. I’ve seen it in my own family experience, people actively pursuing caring vocations, so nurses and teachers and all those sorts of things because they have seen how important those kinds of things were for someone in their life. Often, yeah, you’ll talk to young people and they go, “Oh, I really want to be a social worker.” Or, “I really want to be an occupational therapist because I’ve seen how helpful that they’ve been.”

(16:31):

And so just having knowledge. You don’t really know many other 13-year-olds that are going to talk about wanting to be a speech pathologist or something like that. But they’ve got that knowledge and I think that really sets them up for wonderful futures and careers and all sorts of things and I think that’s … Yeah, I’m really glad that you asked that question. I think it’s something that often gets missed.

Nadia Rossi (Host) (16:50):

How wonderful to know that you have people on your team that have also experienced their life as a young carer. I think as a young carer, knowing that there are people working with you or there at the end of the phone that has even been through their situation, it’s just so comforting to know, I think, in order to kind of bridge that gap and have that understanding.

Isabella Hassall (Guest) (17:14):

I think, yeah, lived experience is something that gets thrown around a lot, but when you see it in action, it is so invaluable to people that we work with.

Nadia Rossi (Host) (17:22):

Isabella, at Carer Gateway, how do you get your message out to young carers and how do they find you? How do you get your message out there to young carers?

Isabella Hassall (Guest) (17:30):

Yeah. Well, we have an amazing partnership team that are always going out and talking to different communities and going to different expos and speaking to hospitals and going and standing in hospitals and talking to people as they come through. We are constantly out there in community events, going to spring carnivals and fairs and wellbeing expos.

(17:54):

I’ve been at a School Counsellor Expo because that’s obviously where a lot of counsellors are finding these things out maybe before the teachers do or other people in the school do and even their friends and that sort of thing. So trying to find the right people that are talking to young carers every day and might not even realise it, other people access it. We touched on it before, but calling the one 1800 number is the best way to do it.

(18:18):

Doesn’t matter where in Australia you are, it’s going to put you through to the service provider that you should be linked into based on your location. Each state has multiple providers, so obviously I’m in New South Wales, there’s four different sections. So it depends where you are, who you’re going to be linked into. But wherever you are, there’ll be a Carer Gateway person hopefully waiting on the phone for you.

Nadia Rossi (Host) (18:39):

Having that visibility at community events and expos to just be … Even someone walking past your banner may not be ready to even engage with you. But just to say, “Oh, that’s what a young carer is.” Or, “There is something out there that could be supporting me or my family.”

Isabella Hassall (Guest) (18:58):

Well, we know that the biggest issue is that young carers don’t know that they’re young carers. I think the stat is that there’s something like almost 400,000 young carers in Australia, is the latest that I saw. So that’s a lot of young people that are doing amazing jobs. And so just trying to reach them wherever they are is what we say, find them where they are and, yeah, I guess when they do access our services, they can get things such as emotional support, which we’ve touched on a few times. The counselling, the coaching, peer support events.

(19:30):

At the moment, I am planning a job ready workshop date. So making sure that people know how to write a resume. We are going to maybe do interview skills and that sort of thing. And then obviously there’s practical supports as well. They might be eligible for funding towards driving lessons. That’s a big one that we see because maybe they’ve got parents that just don’t have the time to teach them how to drive, or maybe they are caring for their parent and their parent can’t drive for whatever reason and let alone not having the time.

(19:56):

But they might not even have an adult in their life that has this skillset to be able to teach them how to drive and driving lessons can be so prohibitively expensive. So helping get them started with that can be a really big one. Similarly, tutoring and other educational supports. So that’s some sort of the practical things we can do as well through Carer Gateway.

Nadia Rossi (Host) (20:18):

That’s just so great that you are filling their toolkit for life and making it accessible. It’s so great to know that there is something out there that these young carers can access and give them those opportunities. Isabella, what advice would you offer to anyone listening today who knows a young carer?

Isabella Hassall (Guest) (20:36):

If you know a young carer, firstly, if you’ve got the capacity, I think it’d be really good to find out what services are available in your local area so that when you do go and have a chat to them, you’ve got some really practical ways that you can point them in the right direction to get further support outside of you. I think something that’s really important as well is that once you have that first check-in, you’re probably going to need to do more check-ins.

(20:58):

I have worked with young people and it sometimes takes them a while to be in a place to accept support. And so if it means that you have to check-in once or twice or 10 times, if you’re able to do that, then that is such an important thing. Obviously, don’t want to be annoying them. But if they have indicated that they do want some support, they might just need a bit more of a push because sometimes they might not feel like they’re entitled to support or that they deserve support, but we obviously know and you obviously know that they do and that’s why you are trying your best.

(21:30):

So they just might need a little bit more prompting. And there are other things that you can do as well. More practically, if you have seen, for example, that they’re caring for a parent, that might mean that they’re missing a bit of a parent figure. So if that means that you can jump in and say, “Hey, I’m happy to take you for driving lessons.” Or, “I’m happy to sit with you and do some maths homework.” Or if it’s, “Do you want to talk about what you want to do when you grow up and do you want me to help you put together a resume to get a new job or to get your first job?”

(22:03):

Or just talking to them about things that they might be not getting from their parent figure. And even if they’re not caring for a parent, their parents are probably really busy with the other person in their life. We see lots of caring roles where there’s multiple caring roles in a family, so if you want to support them and you’ve got the capacity to do so, there are lots of different ways. Obviously, trying to talk to them and figuring out what that is would be the best place to start.

Nadia Rossi (Host) (22:29):

Isabella, if someone is listening to this podcast and has maybe had a realisation that they have a young carer in their life who is caring for them, is there any advice you would have to that person that is receiving care from a young person?

Isabella Hassall (Guest) (22:44):

So yeah, we call them a care recipient, which I think is quite a sort of clinical word. I prefer to say loved one. I think it’s a nice way to put it. So if you are listening to this and you know that there’s a young person that is providing care for you, I think you’re probably the best person for them to talk to about it.

(23:02):

So if you can bring it up with them and say, “Hey, I’m so grateful for all the things that you do for me, and I know that you’re doing more than other kids your age or young people your age, I know that what you’re doing is hard, and I can be hard to care for sometimes. And I’ve heard that there’s things that are out there that are going to be able to support you, that are going to be all about you” that can be maybe a difficult conversation to have, but I think it’s really important.

(23:31):

And yeah, if you’re listening to this and that’s resonated with you, you can also place the referral yourself. So if it’s that you want to call Carer Gateway and you just want to explain your situation, or you want to call even Carers Australia. Or whatever state you’re in, there’ll be a association that supports people and just let them know that you want to get support for the person that supports you.

Nadia Rossi (Host) (23:56):

What a wonderful message to leave on. Thank you, Isabella, for joining us today and for sharing all of your knowledge and practical strategies and tips for young carers in Australia. So, thank you.

Isabella Hassall (Guest) (24:10):

Thank you so much for having me, Nadia. It has been so lovely to talk about young carers.

Nadia Rossi (Host) (24:15):

And thank you to our listeners for joining us. If you would like to keep up to date with our latest conversations, we’d love it if you like and subscribed to our Emerging Minds Families podcast channel. You can also find us on Instagram at Emerging Minds AU or on Facebook at Emerging Minds Families.

(24:31):

You have been listening to an Emerging Minds Families podcast. If anything spoken about in today’s episode has been distressing for you or you find yourself struggling, please reach out for help. You can call Lifeline on 13 11 14 or more resources for support can be found in our show notes.

VO (24:49):

Visit our website at www.emergingminds.com.au/ families for a wide range of free information and resources to help support child and family mental health. Emerging Minds leads the National Workforce Centre for Child Mental Health. The Centre is funded by the Australian Government Department of Health under the National Support for Child and Youth Mental Health Programme.